hyanni dates

[Tad]

while in a nursery today, I had somone pass on to me some hyanni date palm seeds.

these are some of the biggest date seeds I have ever seen. I got about 16 so hopefully at least one will germ.

I still can't get over the enormous size, compared to dact. these things are jumbos.

Does anybody else have some of these?

[Tad]

maybe i am nuts but they just seem abnormaly large

[rubyz]

Hi Tad,

I can easily obtain these by buying a packet of Hayyani dates. From what I can discern, your seeds seem to be of normal size, but it's a bit difficult to tell from your pics.

BTW, I wouldn't leave money lying around like that!

[M@ximus]

Ciao  Tad and  Reuven!

I  usually  eat   this    dates  fresh(from  Israel)

and  naturally  keep  all  seeds

In  my  experience ,  You  have  to  clean  perfectly

the  seeds,(  or  them rotten)  and  dry  them  for  2/3  weeeks or  more

After  that,  put  the  seeds  on  water  for  1 week

and  do  the  usual  procedure

BTW  here  the  name  of  this  date  is  HAYANY,

now  what  is  the  correct  name?

All  the  best    M@x

[rubyz]

(M@ximus @ Apr. 27 2007,08:15)

QUOTE

BTW  here  the  name  of  this  date  is  HAYANY,

now  what  is  the  correct  name?

Hayyani, or Hayany, or whatever, is simply a transliteration of an Arabic word, the meaning of which seems to be unclear. ???

[The Germinator]

What species is this ?

[Tad]

(rubyz @ Apr. 27 2007,00:56)

QUOTE

Hi Tad,

I can easily obtain these by buying a packet of Hayyani dates. From what I can discern, your seeds seem to be of normal size, but it's a bit difficult to tell from your pics.

BTW, I wouldn't leave money lying around like that!

well, dont take it for granted, because we do not usually see these in stores here in my part of Texas.

so what is easy for you is not always easy for everyone else.

compared to the medjool date seeds they are definately larger.

[rubyz]

(palmotrafficante @ Apr. 27 2007,15:12)

QUOTE

well, dont take it for granted, because we do not usually see these in stores here in my part of Texas.

so what is easy for you is not always easy for everyone else.

compared to the medjool date seeds they are definately larger.

Hey, I wasn't trying to be smug - sorry you got that impression.

    I only meant that all kinds of dates are obtainable here in groceries and supermarkets. I'm surprised that they aren't available  to you as imports. And yes, the Hayyani seeds are indeed larger than the Medjools.

    Best of luck with germination!

[M@ximus]

Ciao  Reuven!

How  many  sp  of  Dactylifera  are  available  on Isralel?

I'm  asking  that , because  Dacty  is  one  of   my  favourite  palm

I  have  Hayany, Medjool, Deglet noor, Zahidi, Bahri

and looking  always  for  new sp

Thanks in  advance     M@x

[rubyz]

(M@ximus @ Apr. 28 2007,22:43)

QUOTE

Ciao  Reuven!

How  many  sp  of  Dactylifera  are  available  on Isralel?

I'm  asking  that , because  Dacty  is  one  of   my  favourite  palm

I  have  Hayany, Medjool, Deglet noor, Zahidi, Bahri

and looking  always  for  new sp

Thanks in  advance     M@x

M@x, virtually all of them can be obtained here. There are several nurseries which cultivate a huge number of varieties, and at least one very large nursery which specializes only in palms!

    Of all the Date varieties, the Medjool is the most popular here - in tissue culture propagation as well.

[iamjv]

Hey Max,

 Can you post pics of your phoenix varieties?

 I too really like phoenix palms and often find a phoenix palm that I can't fully identify.  An example of that is in my "San Antonio Palms" album at my webshots link below.  If you go to page 4 in that album, you'll see a phx dacty that I came across recently that I can't identify.  I know it's in the dactylifera family but which variety I don't know...  it has orange color on the frond bases.

 This palm survived the hard freezes of the 80's here and even produced some fruit (seeds) last year.  I have three of those seeds growing now.

Any help would be appreciated.

Jv

[iamjv]

Hey Tad,

 A little more info on your hayani dates...  JV

Hayani

Through its form, texture, taste and storage characteristics, hayani is very distinct from other dates. It is a fresh fruit in its own right. Familiar in Israel, where it is sold practically throughout the year, the marketing of this product in Europe has been undertaken for ten years or so with limited success by the Hadiklaim company. Outside Spain, which takes 700 tonnes, the other European countries only take 500 tonnes per year. Moreover, the consultant who did the survey had some reservations about the Figure s provided by the exporter. While all agree on the total import of 1 200 tonnes, it may be that the estimated tonnage for France and Italy is grossly overestimated, while Spain may take more than the 700 tonnes reported.

Production period

September/October

The keeping of hayani dates

The Israelis call hayani “Fresh All Year Round Dates”. They are frozen, pitted or unpitted, immediately after harvesting. The fibrous texture of the fruit and its high sugar content allow it to undergo this treatment perfectly and to remain in perfect condition in terms of appearance and taste. Once it has been thawed, it really does look as though it had just been harvested.

Logistics

Hayani dates are exported in a 20' refrigerated container containing nine pallets.

Sizes

There are two sizes, jumbo and standard, but they are not always adhered to.

Packaging

They are mainly imported in a 5 kg carton of loose dates. Consumer packaging is handled directly by importers, generally distributing 500-g transparent plastic window boxes.

The prices of hayani dates

The Israeli traders always offer CIF prices. According to the latest information the consultant had, the price of hayani at source was on the decrease.

Logistical constraints on hayani dates

Loose product: the product is supplied frozen directly to the shop. It is then thawed and put on display chilled, depending on demand. It thus retains a shelf life of approximately 10 days. Legally, the shop is bound to indicate that the product has been thawed.

Packed in window boxes: EC legislation provides for the packed products having to show a sell-by date. If the shop is supplied with the frozen product and it thaws it to put it on display, as it would do in the case of the loose product, it is obliged to indicate the sell-by date on each packet. This operation is impossible in practical terms. It can therefore only accept products which are already marked and therefore ones already thawed ready to be put on display. It can clearly be seen that with window box packaging, all the benefits conferred by the frozen product are lost. This becomes very restrictive, since it means the importer has to carry out this marking operation himself. And, above all, it considerably reduces the quantities supplied. In the case of fresh products, shops can only order the quantities needed for several days' sale. It accordingly limits importers of this type, who must be able to guarantee the logistics of the fresh fruit sector - in other words, be capable of supplying shops rapidly over a wide area under profitable economic conditions.

The marketing of hayani dates in Europe

This is dependent on the exporter/importer combination. The Israeli marketing system is based on two principles: a pooling of exports and the choice of a small number of importers per country. As far as the Hadiklaim company - which markets hayani dates but also all other Israeli dates - is concerned, the type of partners they work with already in each country is a determining factor. The ideal importer must therefore be able to sell both products at once. He must be at the same time the seller of dried fruit and the seller of fresh fruit and in addition he must have refrigeration facilities and sufficient resources to repack the product when necessary. It is obvious that ideal candidates are few and far between. In Spain, for example, the Meneu company sells hayani very well, yet only markets a few pallets of mejool.

Limits on the commercial development of hayani dates in Europe

In this connection, the experiment in France in 1996 by the Hadiklaim company and its importer is very revealing. The operation was intended to promote hayani dates in French large-scale retail. The products were offered in two sizes, standard and jumbo, and were packed in 500-g window boxes and loose in 5-kg lots. The customers contacted were the heads of department in hypermarkets with more than 8 000 square metres of floor area. The operation consisted of placing a pallet of 100 cartons and a promoter at the disposal of this store; for two days, the promoter was responsible for promoting sales. Each promoter had sales leaflets and posters. Where stock remained unsold, the importer also undertook to take the remaining products back. The public selling price was FF 19.90 per kilo, carriage paid to the store, for a purchase price of FF 13 per kilo, which left a comfortable margin of just over 30 percent. Following more than fifty promotions, the average quantities sold were 63 cartons per promotion, or approximately FF 7 000 in turnover in two days per store. From these results, the sales potential could be estimated at FF 5 000 per week under normal conditions, viz. without a promoter. Despite these promising results, the importer never managed to go beyond the stage of promotion exercises and get the product bought and stocked in large-scale retailers.

The reasons for this commercial failure are manifold. Firstly, it is due to the centralizing of purchasing decisions in large-scale retailers. Establishing a new product requires an intense commercial effort to convince the different decision-makers, from the top of the organization downwards. Secondly, buyers are uncomfortable with the hybrid nature of the product, which is both frozen and fresh, since it straddles two types of regulations and health rules. It does not integrate well in the merchandising organization of the fruit and vegetable department since it has to be sold loose where it would be preferable to see it in pre-packaged form and it has to be put in chilled display cabinets which are generally used specifically for salads and prepared products. Finally, it does not fit into the organization of purchases, which is based on families of products, under which frozen products are generally stored separately from fruit and vegetables.

This info came from this site which also has good info on other phoenix varities...

[rubyz]

While the summary above is quite informative, a bit more light needs to be shed on Israeli date marketing, as well as the international marketing of all Israeli foodstuffs.

    All Israeli farmers and food producers must sell their produce to Agrexco, the government agricultural conglomeration, at a fixed price. Agrexco also has its hands in marketing practices - not to mention marketing prices.

    You can well imagine, therefore, that farmers will often get screwed, and that marketing schemes will be poorly conceived. It is unfortunate that privatization, which has been successfully introduced over the last thirty years in many areas such as communications, has not yet made its way into the agricultural export scene.

[rubyz]

BTW, as an addendum to my post above, I'd like to point out that because of Agrexco, there used to be a very healthy black market (within Israel) in fruit, eggs, chickens and turkeys. Farmers would come into neighborhoods with their produce, and hawk it over loudspeakers set up on their pickups and vans. This was all very colorful and economical, but naturally, the Agricultural Ministry didn't sit still, and together with the Income Tax Commandos largely cracked down on this. Nowadays there are still some who will travel out to farms to buy directly from farmers who are willing to circumvent Agrexco.

[M@ximus]

(iamjv @ Apr. 29 2007,04:39)

QUOTE

Hey Max,

 Can you post pics of your phoenix varieties?

 I too really like phoenix palms and often find a phoenix palm that I can't fully identify.  An example of that is in my "San Antonio Palms" album at my webshots link below.  If you go to page 4 in that album, you'll see a phx dacty that I came across recently that I can't identify.  I know it's in the dactylifera family but which variety I don't know...  it has orange color on the frond bases.

 This palm survived the hard freezes of the 80's here and even produced some fruit (seeds) last year.  I have three of those seeds growing now.

Any help would be appreciated.

Jv

Ciao  JV!

At  reasonable  size  I  have  only  the  Dactylifera Deglet noor ,  that  is   the  only  one  cultivated  on  nurseryes  ( in Italy) in  past  years,  so  all  other  sp,  are  at  juvenile  stage!

But  I  think  on Internet  you  will  find  many  pics  of  adults dacty

In  another  post  ,  You talking  about    some  Phoenix  cross.

I'm  looking  for  Rupicola x Canariensis,  Roebellini x canariensis,  and  Rupicola  x  Dactylifera

Can  you  suggest  some  address  where  buy  some  Juvenile  cross of  Phoenix

Or  for  swap I  can  offer     Reclinata  x Canariensis

or  Chamaerops  Vulcano  both     3 yo

Ciao    M@x

[iamjv]

Hey Max,

 Unfortunately I don't know of anyone that is hybridizing phoenix.  The one's I've found I have just come upon, via nurserymen I know.  It's been a matter of luck really.  I'm always looking for hybrids so if I find any that fit your needs I'll let you know.

 That reclinataXcanary should be interesting once it matures.

Jv

[Kris]

Dear folks  

Nice topic since iam introducted to these varities by our italian friend_Max.

he has sent me some of these seeds and i have place then in all the possible methods that i know.and its just few weeks,

so cannot show you guys any sprouted stills of it.but its really hot and humid..i feel that in few days these babies are gona sprout.and i will post those still here..

and Max how are you my friend.and thanks a lot for those

seeds...since iam very new to this variety !  

Love,

Kris(India)  

[M@ximus]

Ciao Kris!

I  found  that  this sp  of dacty  need  more  time  to germinate, and  also  mine  are  still  not  germinated

but ,  I  think  some  more  hot  days  ,  can  help germination

Ciao  Kris

[Kris]

Dear Max  

Thanks for those germination tips & For those lovely seeds

hope they all germinate and become beautiful date palm trees one day.

Love,

Kris  

[Kris]

Dear Rubyz  

do you have accesses to regions where this perticularly

variety of date palms are grown.since if its,then can you post stills of these Hayani dates trees_fully grown specimens and with clusters of dates hanging on it.

Thanks & Love,

Kris  

[rubyz]

(krisachar @ May 02 2007,18:18)

QUOTE

Dear Rubyz  

do you have accesses to regions where this perticularly

variety of date palms are grown.since if its,then can you post stills of these Hayani dates trees_fully grown specimens and with clusters of dates hanging on it.

I really don't know offhand where the Hayyani is being cultivated in Israel, but I could find out. Perhaps Ronnie knows. ::

[RRONNIE]

Someone mentioned "Ronnie" ?

Well Date People, allow me shed some light on the issue of Date Palm, edible dates, open questions above and other stuff:

There are as much as 70 (!) edible species of palm/dates throughout the world.

Palm trees grow worldwide from sandy deserts to tropical rain forests

Each culture focused on certain species according to history (development, events), climate and taste preference. The exception - Israel - which developed some of its species according to predictions on export viability and feasibility (which turned out to be worthwhile).

In Hebrew – the Israeli language: "Tamar" = "Date" is a synonym for "Palm" – just to show you its weigh and the place it holds in our culture.

Tamar/date palm is being mentioned numerous times in the Scriptures of the Hebrew Bible. The Jews ate the palm tree dates; the tree juices were fermented into wine; the trunk of the palm tree was used as construction timber; and the palm leaves were woven into baskets, mats, brooms, beds, and ropes and made into furniture.

1 Kings 6.29 “Figures of angels, palm trees, and open flowers were carved on all the walls of both rooms of the Temple and the floor of both rooms was overlaid with gold.”

2 Samuel 13.1 “King Davids son, Absalom, had a beautiful sister named Tamar.”

Till today" Tamar" is a common given name for Israeli new born baby girls - "Tammi", as nickname.

The Greeks and Romans exported the known high quality, edible Judea dates into areas outside the Middle East and Africa.

The New Testament Scriptures note the spreading of Christianity throughout the lands bordering Israel. These lands were known for their palm trees.

Revelation 7.9 “After this I saw a vast crowd, too great to count, from all nations and provinces and languages, standing in front of the throne and before the Lamb, clothed in white, with palm branches in their hands.”

The Islam forbids its believers to cut down Date Palms (they gave the prophet

Muhammad shade, during his time in desert).

The largest date palms plantation in the world (Att. Dear Kris) is in Kibbutz (collective farm) Tirat Tzvi, in Israel – 10,000 date palms – 200 Acre – 900 ton of date per year !!

There are several Kibbutzim that grow date palms especially in "Bait Sheaan" Valley (the perfect land and climate, since biblical times).

In Israel (att. M@x) my Paisons (fellow countrymen) grow 9 (!) species.

They differ in: texture - color – hue – taste – astringency - softness and area of propagation.

They are (the names are translated phonetically – not necessarily scientifically – most "H" pronounced "Back tongue to upper palate – don't spit !):

•Bahri or Bharhi – (from Arabic: "whole" & "healthy" & "innocence") – common name: "The Yellow Date "– origin: Iraq – the most popular one in Middle East! – good for cooking - 3000 trees just in Tirat Tzvi

•Darhi or Deri – dry – black – second most popular in Middle East - 2500 trees just in Tirat Tzvi

•Zahidi - (from Arabic: "unimportant" & "minor" & "negligible") - origin: Iraq – dry date – high yield tree – dates good mainly for baking, jam and tea sweetener (and eating) – 1000 trees just in Tirat Tzvi (who think that economically is not so "unimportant".

•Medjool – accurate pronunciation: MadgHool (strong on the "H") - from Arabic: "unknown" & "anonymous" & "with no name") – common name: "King Solomon" – origin: Morocco - huge – meaty – dark brown – by many considered to be the king of dates; by some tasteless (compare to Bahri, for example) – excellent for cooking – hard to grow in Israel – nevertheless, 700 trees just in Tirat Tzvi - market price (at all levels): twice as any other!

•Hayyani – that is the correct name & writing, in English, M@x – (from Arabic: "treacherous" & "disloyal") - common name: "Jordan (the river) Date" - origin: Egypt – reddish/black – moist – low sugar – ripens on tree gradually (not at the same time), so some fruits (on the same tree) have to be picked early and some late (hence: "treacherous") – good for cooking - 500 trees just in Tirat Tzvi

•Deglet Noor or Deglet Nour - (from Arabic: "palm of light") – the word "Palm" in Hebrew is "Dekel" – see how close to "Deglet"  - "Noor" = light in Hebrew & Arabic - common name: "Sun Palm" – origin: the Sahara desert (Algeria and Tunisia) – dry – amber color  - very pleasant texture – very tasty – excellent for cooking.

•Amari - (from Arabic: "life") - origin: Egypt – "good-looking" (glucose coating) - red/brown – semi sweet – hard to chew (high fiber content) – in the trade, known as – "Possible to sell – Impossible to eat"

•Halawi - (from Arabic: "sweet") - origin: Iraq – very sweet – light brown – high yield per tree – Known in trade as "Noor for the Poor" - 1000 trees just in Tirat Tzvi.

•Hadrawi - (from Arabic: "green") – first to ripen (and picked) - last in demand - least desired.

•Nowadays, a 10th species is "going around", in process – Binth Ayeesha (from Arabic - "daughter of life") – moist – red/black – considered an improvement to the Hayyani, in terms of quality and shelf life.

Enjoy,

Be Good,

Ronnie

[RRONNIE]

I, myself like and recommend you to eat it "straight from the cows brisket" – At pre picked stage - yellow and crunchy like an apple, ripening and softening to a honey-like sweetness.

[RRONNIE]

(M@ximus @ Apr. 28 2007,22:43)

QUOTE

I  have  Hayany, Medjool, Deglet noor, Zahidi, Bahri

and looking  always  for  new sp

Thanks in  advance     M@x

M@X,

Should i contact Tirat Tzvi - see new species' seeds for your collection ? - If they are willing...

Be Good,

Ronnie

[M@ximus]

(RRONNIE @ May 04 2007,02:58)

QUOTE

(M@ximus @ Apr. 28 2007,22:43)

QUOTE

I  have  Hayany, Medjool, Deglet noor, Zahidi, Bahri

and looking  always  for  new sp

Thanks in  advance     M@x

M@X,

Should i contact Tirat Tzvi - see new species' seeds for your collection ? - If they are willing...

Be Good,

Ronnie

Ciao  Ronnie!!

Will  be  great  if  you  can help  me !

I  posted  a  lot  of  messages everywhere ,  looking  for Dacty  sp

But  without  results

Let  me  know  if  I  can  help  you  in some  way,  if   I  don't  find  any  palms for you,  maybe  can  ship  to  you  a  

good  pizza(with  dates)  

Ciao  Ronnie  thank  you  very  much           M@x

[rubyz]

(RRONNIE @ May 04 2007,03:38)

QUOTE

There are several Kibbutzim that grow date palms especially in "Bait Sheaan" Valley (the perfect land and climate, since biblical times).

First of all, thanks, Ronnie, for all that great info.

One of the date-growing kibbutzim that tourists should visit when they come to Israel is Kibbutz Kinneret. This was the very first collective farm established in Israel (about 100 years ago!) and has a very large date palm plantation. The kibbutz also supervises the section of the Jordan River that is reserved for Christians who wish to be baptized or rebaptized (it is called "Yardenit"), and runs a date product factory, complete with store offering all sorts of these products such as date honey, date jelly, and, of course, packaged dates. The store is a tourist trap with high prices, but it is worthwhile just browsing to get an idea of the multitude of foodstuffs that can be produced from the date!

BTW, one of the kibbutz members, Zvi Bernstein, is one of the research scientists working at the nearby Tzemah Date Experimental Station where, among other things, Israelis have developed their version of tissue culture propagation.

[Kris]

Dear Ronnie  

that information is preety neat and totally tharough_Great work man !

iam glad to know that rubyz & you love this phoenix Sp too,

since iam a phoenix freak too.but my first love though is a

CIDP's.since i have never seen them in india.while other

phoenix are also adroreable to me !

Thanks & Love,

Kris  

[RRONNIE]

(M@ximus @ May 04 2007,07:57)

QUOTE

Ciao  Ronnie!!

Will  be  great  if  you  can help  me !

I  posted  a  lot  of  messages everywhere ,  looking  for Dacty  sp

But  without  results

Let  me  know  if  I  can  help  you  in some  way,  if   I  don't  find  any  palms for you,  maybe  can  ship  to  you  a  

good  pizza(with  dates)  

Ciao  Ronnie  thank  you  very  much           M@x

Ciao  M@x, Shalom,

First - It is not clear for what species you would like me to check (on seeds) ??

Second, Yes, please ship me a large pizza - extra Mozzarella, Green Pepper, Salami & hot spice !

But (!), it has to be a pizza made by "Jolly", Pizzeria Ristorante, on Viale Amendola Giovanni, 229 – one of top three I ever tasted !!! - è molto buono - perfetto !!!

Ha, and don't forget a bottle of 20 years old Balsamic sauce, of local (Modena) make !

Grazie, così va bene

I have been to Italy 5 times in the last 2 years – in Modena area for business and last time in Sauze d'Oulx, in the Italian Alps (Grand Hotel Besson), for work & pleasure (see the view in pic.).

And donna Michella.... but, thats another story...

Be Good,

Ciao & Shalom,

Ronnie

[RRONNIE]

M@x,

Party at JOLLY...

Ronnie

[M@ximus]

Ciao  Ronnie!

I'm  looking  for  Phoenix dactylifera var. Zaghloul  &     phoenix  dactylifera var. Samani   seeds

But  also  all  others  sp   with  special  caracteristics

ex:  big  dates,  color of  dates,color  of  leaves (green,  deep green, silver etc)  

Thank  you  Ronnie!

when you  will  be  in  Rome  next  time  let  me  know

Ciao  M@x

[Kris]

Dear Ronnie  

hey that's a real serious party going on ! and the red wine do

seem to make my mouth water...

Happy partying buddy  

Love,

Kris  

[rubyz]

(krisachar @ May 05 2007,08:38)

QUOTE

and the red wine do

seem to make my mouth water...

Dear Kris,

Believe it or not, we make some serious world-class red wine here! Two great varieties are Yarden Golan Cabernet Sauvignon, and Yarden Golan Merlot.

Strangelly enough, they are both excellent even though they are made from grapes, and not from dates!

[Kris]

Dear Rubyz  

that information is great ! and we have wine all comming to us from france,holland & austrailia.

and your country makes fentastic agriculture products,recently there was an expo,there i saw garden tools & shower head with orange handles they looked so beautiful.that i said the dealer i will not able to use it in dirt or soil.as i fear it will get soiled...so nice it was.

but since i had my tools & garden implements already purschased long back,i was just window shopping there.

my tools are from Stanley Industries.and seem to have worked well till now.

Love,

Kris  

[RRONNIE]

(rubyz @ May 05 2007,08:45)

QUOTE

(krisachar @ May 05 2007,08:38)

QUOTE

and the red wine do seem to make my mouth water...

Dear Kris,

Believe it or not, we make some serious world-class red wine here! Two great varieties are Yarden Golan Cabernet Sauvignon, and Yarden Golan Merlot.

Strangelly enough, they are both excellent even though they are made from grapes, and not from dates!

Dear Kris'

If you like Merlot - once you'll taste "yarden Golan Merlot" - you will never go for any other (and you will most probably' ask your two freind in Israel to send you a case...)  :laugh:  

http://www.cffcheers.com/search_result.asp...trSearch=Israel

Be Good,

Ronnie

[Kris]

Dear Ronnie  

i think from now on i must tell my friends visiting foregin lands to buy wines from Israel.

and now to the statement_

for marbles & Sexy cars its italy,

for wines its israel,

for palms its madagascar,

for Draceonia its Canary islands,

for me its India...

Love conquors all,

Kris  

[M@ximus]

(krisachar @ May 05 2007,18:05)

QUOTE

Dear Ronnie  

i think from now on i must tell my friends visiting foregin lands to buy wines from Israel.

and now to the statement_

for marbles & Sexy cars its italy,

for wines its israel,

for palms its madagascar,

for Draceonia its Canary islands,

for me its India...

Love conquors all,

Kris  

Ciao  Kris!!

You  leave  out  Usa, Australia, Uk, Germany,  Vatican city

etc, etc,  

You  are  the  best!!

A  huge   embrace    !!   M@x

[rubyz]

(krisachar @ May 05 2007,19:05)

QUOTE

for marbles & Sexy cars its italy,

for wines its israel,

for palms its madagascar,

for Draceonia its Canary islands,

for me its India...

Love conquors all,

Dear Kris and M@x,

Let's not forget Israel's wonderful dates, and for olives and olive oil - it's both Italy and Israel!

I have had the good fortune to eat at the very finest restaurants in Rome, and these are among the best in the world - if not the best!  :cool:  

[Kris]

Dear Rubyz & Dear Max  

if at all i want to praise god creation one day & one page will never be sufficient for me ! and every country has something very unique thing to offer to the emancipation of our human race.

iam a history student & also a nature lover,so for about 6 to 8 years i have no travel plans.but when i wish to move around it will be certainly places of historic signifance only.so you folks can guess where....

they are :- Italy,greece,iraq,syria,hungary,ausrtia,spain,portugal,

egypt,moracco,afghnistan & China.

but first landing will be the ceasers land and my friend Max is there.

And must visit land will be_Isreal.because i have emmense respect for the jew biblical characters_Mosses,david,soloman and last but not the least the mesrire of love & peace_jesus land.

and to meet our buddies Ronnie & Rubyz.

and rubyz all these days i thought you were a charming young isreal lady.but in the age of the gardener threat you mentioned you are married to lady.then i realised you are a man.but i like your user i.d.since i knew and had many

girl friends by that name.and brought very fond memories of by gone days !i think you want mind calling you by that

i.d name itself.

Love,

Kris  

[RRONNIE]

(krisachar @ May 06 2007,09:38)

QUOTE

....and rubyz all these days i thought you were a charming young isreal lady.....

Love,

Kris  

Dear Kris

You should have gone to rubys profile ....

Indeed charming - but charming Lad - not Lady      

Be Good,

Ronnie

[rubyz]

(krisachar @ May 06 2007,09:38)

QUOTE

_and rubyz all these days i thought you were a charming young isreal lady

Don't feel too disappointed, Kriis!

I've been fooling my wife for the last 11 years...