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Zones ...again


Steve Mac

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It has been apparent to me for quite a while now, that some people in America, Germany, Greece, Spain, Melbourne and some other countries, have as much insight into our Sydney weather as I do.

So just out of interest can I ask you world travelers, what other parts of America and the rest of the world has a similar climate to coastal Sydney?  

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Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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Crickey mate,  are there any statistics that you don't have access to? :D

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Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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Closest comparison is probably Northern Portugal/Northwestern Spain

Then South Africa (Cape Town)

And Southern California though rainfall is much lower 

 

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Jonathan

Katy, TX (Zone 9a)

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Another issue with Sydney weather is that as it is a big area so my climate also is very different to Steve,s ( Thirnleigh to Cronulla ) ... He is much luckier than I am in this regard ...

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The weather in Galicia, in the northwest of Spain is similar. Temperate rain forest.

image.jpeg

image.jpeg

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On 10 May 2016 at 12:10:22 AM, Mohsen said:

Another issue with Sydney weather is that as it is a big area so my climate also is very different to Steve,s ( Thirnleigh to Cronulla ) ... He is much luckier than I am in this regard ...

This morning about 7:00 AM we had 7 c temp while I checked it was 13 c in Cronulla ... I am really worry about the coldest winter moments here :( 

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Thanks guys that has helped.

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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These 3 places located in South of Turkey. I think temps are more or less same especially Anamur where the min record is -0,8C. But in Mediterranean basin summers are dry, rain happens 1-2 days out of 30 during May - October period. These 3 places are famous for tropical plant growing in Turkey.

Alanya.jpg

anamur.jpg

marmaris.jpg

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Unfortunately there is no place in North America that has a climate similar to Sydney's, if it did it the US would have made a land grab for it long ago. In our hemisphere coastal Uruguay comes about as close as you'll find https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punta_del_Este#Climate . Over in Africa, it starts to taper off around Sydney's latitude but East London and wetter summer areas of the eastern Cape would be next-best, though they're a bit drier and have warmer winters. And that's really about it, most places around the world with your kind of temperatures don't have the year-round rain and turn out to be better matches for areas with Mediterranean climates such as Perth. The eastern coasts of North America and Asia are too continental at the mid-latitudes to be taken seriously.

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Winter Haven, FL at 28 degrees north has a record low of -7.2c in both December and January.  Sydney is at 33 degrees south.  I have to drive 7 hours north, at 100 +kph, to get to 33 degrees, and the record lows there are -15C or worse (even -20C!) That gives an idea of the difference between the Southeastern US and Southeastern AU.  Here there are not many palms north of 33 degrees north (but there are some - Sabals, Trachycarpus, Rhapidiophyllum).  In winter at 33N in the SE USA, the trees are mostly bare just like they are at 50 degrees North.

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Land O Lakes FL, a suburb on the North Side of Tampa, FL

Summers are great, 90f/32c in the day & 70f/21c at night with plentiful rain & sun

Winters are subtropical with occasional frosts and freezes. Tropical cyclones happen.

We have a few Royal palms in the warm microclimates but Coconuts freeze.

I am a Kayaker, Hiker, Bicyclist, and amateur Photographer that loves the outdoors.  

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I don't get it. Why do you think that any place at the same latitude north is not the same temp/weather as the same latitude south e.g. Sydney, on the coast?

There are a few variables that I am unaware of, but I am not interested in any of that weird conspiracy stuff that I found when I searched '33rd parallel'.

I'm thinking that there is much more land mass in the north, and perhaps local conditions (vegetation mountains) affect rainfall more than I would have guessed.

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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4 minutes ago, gtsteve said:

I don't get it. Why do you think that any place at the same latitude north is not the same temp/weather as the same latitude south e.g. Sydney, on the coast?

There are a few variables that I am unaware of, but I am not interested in any of that weird conspiracy stuff that I found when I searched '33rd parallel'.

I'm thinking that there is much more land mass in the north, and perhaps local conditions (vegetation mountains) affect rainfall more than I would have guessed.

Geography.  We are connected to the Arctic by land.  Land doesn't modify cold temps the way water does.  When a powerful blast of cold plows down from the North, it just rolls over the entire continent.  In Sydney, the Antarctic cold is modified by the southern ocean.  If you go to California, the Pacific has a huge modifying affect on the climate and extreme lows.  But sometimes the cold sneaks west of the Rocky Mountains and the cold makes it to the coast.  That's unusual but it does happen frequently enough to influence what grows there.  Here on the east coast we suffer from climate envy whenever we think about a place like Sydney.  :-)

You do touch on something interesting when you ask about latitude and climate.  If you compare San Franscisco, St Louis, and Washington DC, all at the Same latitude, their average annual temperatures are nearly identical.  However the climates are quite distinct.  San Francisco rarely freezes, St Louis & Washington freeze regularly from October till April.  St Louis has a record high of 46c, San Francisco 39c, DC, 41.  Record lows for San Francisco are about -5c, St Louis is about -30c and DC is about -22c.  Even in DC, the water helps...a bit.  But the annual averages are nearly identical.  So which one is colder?  By the annual averages, they are the same, but St Louis and DC are definitely colder.

I missed the 33rd parallel mythology.  Is it good, like Area 51/alien crap?

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Land O Lakes FL, a suburb on the North Side of Tampa, FL

Summers are great, 90f/32c in the day & 70f/21c at night with plentiful rain & sun

Winters are subtropical with occasional frosts and freezes. Tropical cyclones happen.

We have a few Royal palms in the warm microclimates but Coconuts freeze.

I am a Kayaker, Hiker, Bicyclist, and amateur Photographer that loves the outdoors.  

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11 minutes ago, Keith in SoJax said:

Geography.  We are connected to the Arctic by land.  Land doesn't modify cold temps the way water does.  When a powerful blast of cold plows down from the North, it just rolls over the entire continent.  In Sydney, the Antarctic cold is modified by the southern ocean.  If you go to California, the Pacific has a huge modifying affect on the climate and extreme lows.  But sometimes the cold sneaks west of the Rocky Mountains and the cold makes it to the coast.  That's unusual but it does happen frequently enough to influence what grows there.  Here on the east coast we suffer from climate envy whenever we think about a place like Sydney.  :-)

You do touch on something interesting when you ask about latitude and climate.  If you compare San Franscisco, St Louis, and Washington DC, all at the Same latitude, their average annual temperatures are nearly identical.  However the climates are quite distinct.  San Francisco rarely freezes, St Louis & Washington freeze regularly from October till April.  St Louis has a record high of 46c, San Francisco 39c, DC, 41.  Record lows for San Francisco are about -5c, St Louis is about -30c and DC is about -22c.  Even in DC, the water helps...a bit.  But the annual averages are nearly identical.  So which one is colder?  By the annual averages, they are the same, but St Louis and DC are definitely colder.

I missed the 33rd parallel mythology.  Is it good, like Area 51/alien crap?

Not to mention plenty of palm trees grow just fine well north of the 33rd parallel here on the west coast :D

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"I missed the 33rd parallel mythology.  Is it good, like Area 51/alien crap?"

Oh yeah, secret societies know more about 330 than we do. :D

Cheers Steve

It is not dead, it is just senescence.

   

 

 

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So now really wonder why Coconuts can grow in Florida but not in Mediterranean basin? Because as fas as mentioned here some places in FL record low is -7.2C but here in Turkey Alanya no frost recorded ever and in Anamur record low is -0,8C. Any idea?

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13 hours ago, NorCalKing said:

Not to mention plenty of palm trees grow just fine well north of the 33rd parallel here on the west coast :D

Ping Ping Ping on the climate envy index meter!  :-)

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Land O Lakes FL, a suburb on the North Side of Tampa, FL

Summers are great, 90f/32c in the day & 70f/21c at night with plentiful rain & sun

Winters are subtropical with occasional frosts and freezes. Tropical cyclones happen.

We have a few Royal palms in the warm microclimates but Coconuts freeze.

I am a Kayaker, Hiker, Bicyclist, and amateur Photographer that loves the outdoors.  

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30 minutes ago, kutsalangemon said:

So now really wonder why Coconuts can grow in Florida but not in Mediterranean basin? Because as fas as mentioned here some places in FL record low is -7.2C but here in Turkey Alanya no frost recorded ever and in Anamur record low is -0,8C. Any idea?

Well, Coconuts grow here in Winter Haven but just between freeze events (we have 2 that have survived for 24 months now, though they are butt ugly).  When you get into warm microclimates like large lakes in the city of Orlando, or the beaches of either coast, you will find Coconuts that endure for 10+ years, though they rarely reach the grandeur of those in the true tropics.  Our average annual temperature is 70F (21c)+ and that seems to be important.  Also, the cold snaps rarely last more than a 3-4 days.  Once they pass, its coconut weather again.  I think the persistent cool weather in the Med basin is limiting just like it is in California.

Land O Lakes FL, a suburb on the North Side of Tampa, FL

Summers are great, 90f/32c in the day & 70f/21c at night with plentiful rain & sun

Winters are subtropical with occasional frosts and freezes. Tropical cyclones happen.

We have a few Royal palms in the warm microclimates but Coconuts freeze.

I am a Kayaker, Hiker, Bicyclist, and amateur Photographer that loves the outdoors.  

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32 minutes ago, kutsalangemon said:

So now really wonder why Coconuts can grow in Florida but not in Mediterranean basin? Because as fas as mentioned here some places in FL record low is -7.2C but here in Turkey Alanya no frost recorded ever and in Anamur record low is -0,8C. Any idea?

 

not enough winter heat. and those locations have a lot of rain in the winter and causes the coconuts to rot. if those locations had less winter rain and about 4 degrees warmer during the day and 2 degrees warmer at night. they would probably grow.

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13 hours ago, gtsteve said:

"I missed the 33rd parallel mythology.  Is it good, like Area 51/alien crap?"

Oh yeah, secret societies know more about 330 than we do. :D

Ha, maybe Tom Cruise has his house on the 33rd!  Zenu would approve.

Land O Lakes FL, a suburb on the North Side of Tampa, FL

Summers are great, 90f/32c in the day & 70f/21c at night with plentiful rain & sun

Winters are subtropical with occasional frosts and freezes. Tropical cyclones happen.

We have a few Royal palms in the warm microclimates but Coconuts freeze.

I am a Kayaker, Hiker, Bicyclist, and amateur Photographer that loves the outdoors.  

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  • 1 year later...
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Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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  • 2 months later...

Sydney I would say along the coast is subtropical. I live on the coast and bananas, papayas grow like weeds. The water temperature Harley drops below 18c, daytime temps where I am are around 19-20c in winter. We can get the cold fronts though and we can get a maximum of 15-16c. At night quite often it’s 8-9c. It’s quite humid also  

 

as for a matching climate. It would have to be somewhere east of Cape Town towards port Elizabeth. Only comparison possible. California is too dry and not humid 

Edited by Nick1985
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