Jump to content
  • WELCOME GUEST

    It looks as if you are viewing PalmTalk as an unregistered Guest.

    Please consider registering so as to take better advantage of our vast knowledge base and friendly community.  By registering you will gain access to many features - among them are our powerful Search feature, the ability to Private Message other Users, and be able to post and/or answer questions from all over the world. It is completely free, no “catches,” and you will have complete control over how you wish to use this site.

    PalmTalk is sponsored by the International Palm Society. - an organization dedicated to learning everything about and enjoying palm trees (and their companion plants) while conserving endangered palm species and habitat worldwide. Please take the time to know us all better and register.

    guest Renda04.jpg

Head sawed off my Butyagrus...


Waterboyke

Recommended Posts

Hi all,

First of all sorry for my bad english (google translation)

I'm Dimi and i'm from Belgium (Europe) This topic contains a lot of pictures, hopefully this is not disturbing?

Since the end of 2009 I got a Butyagrus. Bought as a small seedling and has grown a lot over the years. He grew very fast, but in the summer of 2013, he suddenly started to make much smaller leaves
At the end of that summer there was only a mini spear in the heart and then he stopped growing. Early this year (2014) I planted it in open ground, he began never to grow back, but the strain started to become thicker and tear open. In August, I was afraid he would destroy himself and I have sawed off his head to make the blockage free.

Pictures say more than words.
Below are some pictures in the summer of 2013 when it grew still beautiful...

IMG_2605.jpg

IMG_3711_Medium.jpg

IMG_3707_Medium.jpg

Below pictures from early this year when he had just planted...

IMG_4445_Large.jpg

IMG_4447_Large.jpg

IMG_4448_Large.jpg

Continued on next post....

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Below pictures of August when I started making really worry...


IMG_4934_Large.jpg



IMG_4936_Large.jpg

IMG_4937_Large.jpg

IMG_4938_Large.jpg



IMG_4941_Large.jpg

IMG_4942_Large.jpg

Continued on next post.....

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Below just after cutting...

IMG_4964_Large.jpg

IMG_4963_Large.jpg



IMG_4959_Large.jpg

IMG_4958_Large.jpg

Continued on next post...

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Below a few hours later after cutting...

IMG_4965_Large.jpg

Below a day after cutting...

19_Augustus_4.jpg

Below 48 hours later than the above photo...

21_Augustus_1.jpg



21_Augustus_3.jpg

Below 3 days later...

24_Augustus_1.jpg



24_Augustus_3.jpg

Continued on next post....

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Below 6 days later...

30_Augustus_1.jpg


Below 4 days later...

03_September_1.jpg


Below 3 days later...

06_September_1.jpg






Below another 3 days later...


09_September_2.jpg

09_September_3.jpg

09_September_4.jpg


What a mess, but still glad he's back now recovering :)

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Done this late in the year, that thing is going to need some serious TLC throughout the winter.

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Dimi. Thanks for posting those amazing photos. I've never been in a situation to see the meristem growth like that. Amazing growth in such a short timeframe.

So I noticed that the palm looked very wet in many of the photos. Did you have a lot of rain during this time and/or maybe overwatered it? I noticed in the last photos the hookleaf "z" pattern in the leaves as they were emerging. That plus the kind of stunted frizzled growth. Is this an example of a boron deficiency in a young palm? Thinking the water leached the boron out of the soil....We observed the hookleaf pattern in a few of our fronds on a butyagrus and adjacent mule shortly after a month of almost daily downpours during a winter season. Our palms were much larger than yours and the condition was not as severe and noticable as yours. Curious to hear what others think.

BTW you have a wonderful palm garden there. Hard for me to imagine that you're in Belgium and not some where a bit warmer. Nice job.

Zone 9b (formerly listed as Zone 9a); Sunset 14

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I echo what WCG said in the above post. I would also add to make sure you have no air pockets around the root area. Good luck.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Done this late in the year, that thing is going to need some serious TLC throughout the winter.

Yes I know Keith, it's late in the year. I do not wanted really do this but this is my favorite and I definitely wanted not to lose it. Now I'm very happy that he's back recovering and that I saved him from his blockage. Next winter it will be well protected. Will you please explain me what "TLC" mean, this abbreviation I do not Know sorry ?

Hi Dimi. Thanks for posting those amazing photos. I've never been in a situation to see the meristem growth like that. Amazing growth in such a short timeframe.

So I noticed that the palm looked very wet in many of the photos. Did you have a lot of rain during this time and/or maybe overwatered it? I noticed in the last photos the hookleaf "z" pattern in the leaves as they were emerging. That plus the kind of stunted frizzled growth. Is this an example of a boron deficiency in a young palm? Thinking the water leached the boron out of the soil....We observed the hookleaf pattern in a few of our fronds on a butyagrus and adjacent mule shortly after a month of almost daily downpours during a winter season. Our palms were much larger than yours and the condition was not as severe and noticable as yours. Curious to hear what others think.

BTW you have a wonderful palm garden there. Hard for me to imagine that you're in Belgium and not some where a bit warmer. Nice job.

I was also very surprised to see, after sawing, this enormous growth. There must have been a huge tension I think. That explains why the strain from all sides began to burst. Without sawing he would destroy himself I think, it was really blocked well. A big bottleneck literally.

In many photos, it is indeed very wet, the period before, during and after the sawing was very wet, a lot of rain (even records were broken here) Many photos are made ​​between the rain showers. He stands on the hottest and sunniest spot in the garden. The problem lasted for a whole year. Since August 2013 to August 2014 now nothing has grown above the ground. Only the strain began to thicken and burst. I have long hoped that it would automatically break back through the pressure and get resolved, but after a year I started really to fear. When I see how extreme the spears look now coming out, I do not think it would ever come good by itself.

BTW, thanks for the compliments of my garden, I protect my palms very well during the winters. Is certainly needed here in Belgium, cold and humid climate.

I echo what WCG said in the above post. I would also add to make sure you have no air pockets around the root area. Good luck.

Thanks for the tip Alice, but I'm quite sure there are no air pockets around the root area, also the problem had already started last year when he was still in pot. When planting early this year I saw that there were a lot of roots present and these were also very healthy.

Someone who might know a reason why the growth is so start stuck? Could this come through over-fertilization? Soil and growing conditions are always good and unchanged.

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

TLC means "Tender Loving Care."

In my post I sometimes express "my" opinion. Warning, it may differ from "your" opinion. If so, please do not feel insulted, just state your own if you wish. Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or any other damages

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, so simple, thanks for clarifying Keith. :blush2:

it will very sure get a lot of TLC

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you saved your palm.....it will do much better in the ground. The big thing is to keep it from getting too cold this winter while it is in recovery mode. Let us see it again next April or May ..... bet it will have 2-3 nice full length fronds.

David Simms zone 9a on Highway 30a

200 steps from the Gulf in NW Florida

30 ft. elevation and sandy soil

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks, I will definitely protect him well this winter

Updates are sure to follow :greenthumb:

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Dimi, welcome!

Your English is perfectly okay!

Definitely protect your palm from too much cold in the winter. Maybe cover it up with a garbage can at night or when it snows?

Let us know what happens.

Let's keep our forum fun and friendly.

Any data in this post is provided 'as is' and in no event shall I be liable for any damages, including, without limitation, damages resulting from accuracy or lack thereof, insult, or lost profits or revenue, claims by third parties or for other similar costs, or any special, incidental, or consequential damages arising out of my opinion or the use of this data. The accuracy or reliability of the data is not guaranteed or warranted in any way and I disclaim liability of any kind whatsoever, including, without limitation, liability for quality, performance, merchantability and fitness for a particular purpose arising out of the use, or inability to use my data. Other terms may apply.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Instead of decapitation of all the green growth, would it make more sense to use a hand saw to cut an X into the top of the meristem to allow drainage and relieve pressure.

Longview, Texas :: Record Low: -5F, Feb. 16, 2021 :: Borderline 8A/8B :: '06-'07: 18F / '07-'08: 21F / '08-'09: 21F / '09-'10: 14F / '10-'11: 15F / '11-'12: 24F / '12-'13: 23F / '13-'14: 15F / '14-'15: 20F / '15-'16: 27F / '16-'17: 15F / '17-'18: 8F / '18-'19: 23F / '19-'20: 19F / '20-'21: -5F / '21-'22: 20F / '22-'23: 6F

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont know if that would have been a solution Buffy. Thanks for your tip.
Here's another update.

September 22...

22_September_2014_1.jpg

22_September_2014_2.jpg

September 29...

27_September_2014_1.jpg

27_September_2014_2.jpg

27_September_2014_3.jpg

Greets Dimi ! My garden --> http//palmvrienden.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=2071

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 weeks later...

Dimi, I also believe the palm is suffering a Boron deficiency. I use the brand "20 Mule Team borax" (which is actually a laundry detergent composed of Sodium Borate) when I see symptoms like this. Recently I treated a Copernicia alba with similar symptoms. I added approximately a gram to 15 liters of water and dumped it at the base of the tree. That concentration was high enough to kill weeds at the base of the tree, so applying boron should be done with great caution. The palm is looking better but it may take a year or more for it to regain normal growth (if it does). Boron is an essential element for plant growth, but the acutal quanitity needed is tiny. The difference between applying enough to correct a deficiency and enough to kill the plant via accidental overdose is remarkably close. So be careful. For what its worth, a recognized palm nutrition expert, Dr Timothy Broschat, once told me he thinks Boron deficiency often occurrs in episodes that are driven by flooding (at least in south Florida). South Florida soils are derrived from limestone, Calcium carbonate. In the plant, the balance of Boron to Calcium is critical. If a flooding rain causes a lot of calcium to go into soil solution for a short period of time, it creates an imbalance of between the amount of Boron and Calcium available. So the palm absorbs too much Calcium in relation to Boron. Once the soil dries out that imbalance ends. However, in our large palms (such as Royal palms), it might take 6-9 months for the tissue/fronds that formed during the time of the imbalance to emerge out of top of the tree. But once they do, the symptoms are visible but no one remembers the flooding rains. Your situation may be (probably is?) different.

Land O Lakes FL, a suburb on the North Side of Tampa, FL

Summers are great, 90f/32c in the day & 70f/21c at night with plentiful rain & sun

Winters are subtropical with occasional frosts and freezes. Tropical cyclones happen.

We have a few Royal palms in the warm microclimates but Coconuts freeze.

I am a Kayaker, Hiker, Bicyclist, and amateur Photographer that loves the outdoors.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...