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Dypsis leptocheilos x decaryi (Tri-Bear)


LJG

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Dypsis leptocheilos x decaryi has quite a bit of variability as you would expect from a cross. I am currently growing three palms from three different crosses that were made. Each a little different. But all awesome palms for Southern Cal.

This first one is my favorite. It is actually an opposite cross from what is usually found. This is Dypsis decaryi x leptocheilos. This was purchased as a 3 gallon palm in 2007 out of FL from a good friend Tri Tvoung. It is even more special now as he passed away only in his early 40s. Tri acquired this palm out of Australia originally. This one has more Leptocheilos in it I believe. The shot of the crown area shows much more red fuzz that carries onto the petioles. It's leaflets are wide and think. The canopy is more open as well. It is also harder to grow with requirements more in line with Leptocheilos rather than Decaryii. Look how white it is when old leaf bases fall off too.

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Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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The second one I got in 2008 as a 10 gallon from Bill Sanford via Jeff Searle. Pretty much all large TriBear crosses you use in California took a magic carpet ride to Cali from FL that spring of 2008. So this version is much more common in gardens here thanks to that trip.

This cross is more Decaryii and grows more inline with that side of the family tree. It handles anything thrown at and is not picky about nutrient requirements like my first one is. The crown area isn't as attractive in my opinion. This version likes to holds its leaves more erect or ascending and has skinnier leaflets. This version seem to have a fatter trunk as well.

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Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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The last one I have is in a 7 gallon pot waiting for Bob De Jong to come a dig a plant out of my garden so it can be planted. This version came from a manual cross that JD at Sea Breeze Nursery in FL did. Bob bought some plants a few years back and I ended up with this and I am looking forward to getting it in the ground. Just guessing but having grown two now from about this size, I would say this one is going to be more in the middle of the other two from what I can tell. I just need to plant it and see.

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Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Great looking palms Len. I got 3 all from the same seed batch. Do you think they will all look the same?

"it's not dead it's sleeping"

Santee ca, zone10a/9b

18 miles from the ocean

avg. winter 68/40.avg summer 88/64.records 113/25

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Interesting. Those are some really pretty plants Len. I thought that all of these were D. leptocheilos x decaryi, not D. decaryi x leptocheilos.

Matt Bradford

"Manambe Lavaka"

Spring Valley, CA (8.5 miles inland from San Diego Bay)

10B on the hill (635 ft. elevation)

9B in the canyon (520 ft. elevation)

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Lookn Beautiful Len :greenthumb: , these are imo when they "look their best", they may well look fantastic forever for you Len but here and in "many" Oz gardens the twist in the leaf ( some here did a full 360) was so extreme they became very untidy and had to face the chainsaw :)

Im sure "Yours Len" will look 'Fantastic Forever"

In the hybrid plant world , some are "Beauties" ( yours Len) and some are or become "Dudds" ( 7/10 here) and most Ive seen in Oz

Pete :)

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Great looking palms Len. I got 3 all from the same seed batch. Do you think they will all look the same?

Did your come from JD? Judging from how all the ones I see from JD look very similar and the fact the Searle cross has similar traits amongst it, I would bet they will look similar but since it is a cross will have some degree are variability. But I would plan on them looking pretty similar.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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On 9/3/2014, 4:08:38, MattyB said:

Interesting. Those are some really pretty plants Len. I thought that all of these were D. leptocheilos x decaryi, not D. decaryi x leptocheilos.

 

You are right so I edited my title to reflect what most are. 

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Great looking palms Len. I got 3 all from the same seed batch. Do you think they will all look the same?

Did your come from JD? Judging from how all the ones I see from JD look very similar and the fact the Searle cross has similar traits amongst it, I would bet they will look similar but since it is a cross will have some degree are variability. But I would plan on them looking pretty similar.

Thanks Len. I did get them from JD. I still have no idea where I can plant one let alone 3. Looks like I'll have to remove something.

"it's not dead it's sleeping"

Santee ca, zone10a/9b

18 miles from the ocean

avg. winter 68/40.avg summer 88/64.records 113/25

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Steve there is always room for just one more :) Get at least one in the ground, these things take off in the ground. The others you don't find room for will be some valuable trade bait later.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Interesting. Those are some really pretty plants Len. I thought that all of these were D. leptocheilos x decaryi, not D. decaryi x leptocheilos.

i was going to make a similar thread in regards to the variability of D. leptocheilos x decaryi since i was putting away some pots and thinking if i should plant one more. all the ones i got from Seabreeze are D. leptocheilos x decaryi but i have one that i got at a PSSC auction with a Kevin Weaver tag that said D. decaryi x leptocheilos and i was curious to see if anyone had somewhat mature ones planted.

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Steve there is always room for just one more :) Get at least one in the ground, these things take off in the ground. The others you don't find room for will be some valuable trade bait later.

the one i have in the ground has been slow from a solid 15gal size, just opening its 2nd frond since end of last year, where as a regular D. leptocheilos has opened about 4 fronds and was planted about the same time from a large 1gal. they're both planted in the exact same soil and full all day sun. the hybrid did have much more root disturbance though and gave me slightly crimped leaves so hopefully that's all it is and by next growing season it'll kick into gear

edit: i was just thinking about it and it's probably my slowest palm that's been planted

Edited by KennyRE317
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Dypsis leptocheilos x decaryi has quite a bit of variability as you would expect from a cross......

Speaking from a Mendelian genetics point of view if it is indeed D .leptocheilos x decaryi which is an F1 cross that would be the last thing I would expect, in fact I would expect complete uniformity while leaning towards the mother especially from a controlled hand pollinated cross of two pure species. Unless some other species entirely is involved like chance pollen coming in.

If either but more likely it would be the leptocheilos I expect is already a hybrid that would be an F2 cross, then I would expect entirely some quite random looking palms. I think yours might not be all F1.

An employee of mine was in Florida two weeks ago and he very 'kindly' (next he will be washing my car :hmm::indifferent: ) took delivery of three from JD at Sea-breeze's all planted out already with each its own shade cloth hut along a path with five umbrella ficus topiary in between then punctuated on one side by the car park the end side by a mature D .decaryi itself.

They all look the same but younger than your JD one. Im hoping they are of course F1 crosses as promised or Im in "Alice and Wonderland" territory where nothing will be quite what it seems.

They seem to have the F1 vigour or heterosis as they began rooting through the mesh in the holding pots in just the one week after quite an epic journey.

I wouldnt ordinarily go for a hybrid at all in fact Im quite surprised by myself but wanted something that would grow fast and look attractive....touch wood

Cerdic

Non omnis moriar (Horace)

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Dypsis leptocheilos x decaryi has quite a bit of variability as you would expect from a cross......

Speaking from a Mendelian genetics point of view if it is indeed D .leptocheilos x decaryi which is an F1 cross that would be the last thing I would expect, in fact I would expect complete uniformity while leaning towards the mother especially from a controlled hand pollinated cross of two pure species. Unless some other species entirely is involved like chance pollen coming in.

You are talking about genes from two different plants in each of the three crosses I have. You are also talking about Dypsis which has a high degree of variability within each species. You will not get uniformity in such hybrids. However as I pointed out to Steve, there is uniformity within the cross of the same two plants offspring. Hence why I can tell a Searle cross from a JD cross.

I know of no F2s of this cross being done.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Steve there is always room for just one more :) Get at least one in the ground, these things take off in the ground. The others you don't find room for will be some valuable trade bait later.

the one i have in the ground has been slow from a solid 15gal size, just opening its 2nd frond since end of last year, where as a regular D. leptocheilos has opened about 4 fronds and was planted about the same time from a large 1gal. they're both planted in the exact same soil and full all day sun. the hybrid did have much more root disturbance though and gave me slightly crimped leaves so hopefully that's all it is and by next growing season it'll kick into gear

edit: i was just thinking about it and it's probably my slowest palm that's been planted

Bummer. Sounds like it doesn't like something where it is or suffered some damage during planting. This cross tends to be a quick grower for a Dypsis. So give it a time and it will be cruising.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Lookn Beautiful Len :greenthumb: , these are imo when they "look their best", they may well look fantastic forever for you Len but here and in "many" Oz gardens the twist in the leaf ( some here did a full 360) was so extreme they became very untidy and had to face the chainsaw :)

Im sure "Yours Len" will look 'Fantastic Forever"

In the hybrid plant world , some are "Beauties" ( yours Len) and some are or become "Dudds" ( 7/10 here) and most Ive seen in Oz

Pete :)

Thanks Pete. I saw some ratty looking ones on here years ago. I also have seen some lanky ones in FL. I think the dry air here makes them fatter and more compact so we should be OK. I hope :)

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Lookn Beautiful Len :greenthumb: , these are imo when they "look their best", they may well look fantastic forever for you Len but here and in "many" Oz gardens the twist in the leaf ( some here did a full 360) was so extreme they became very untidy and had to face the chainsaw :)

Im sure "Yours Len" will look 'Fantastic Forever"

In the hybrid plant world , some are "Beauties" ( yours Len) and some are or become "Dudds" ( 7/10 here) and most Ive seen in Oz

Pete :)

Im not liking the sound of twisted leaves Pedro 65! Are these random crosses or controlled F1's either way that sounds very disturbing, pictures please [blush] says I who can't take a focused picture if I tried?

I can see a few leaves on some of Lens are twisted slightly is this what you mean?

What I have noticed having sudden vested interests and all is that a few have bent or partily twisted entire canopies like in 06:51AM@Len above. Not sure if this is environment or not but I've seen a few now like this, maybe simpy not enough open sunshine, I know D.decaryii can get a bit warped and attenuated if it's not in good sun?

I saw a very nice mature one on another thread here at PT it didn't have twisted anything. Im not sure if it was F1 it looked very nice, basicaly a sturdy triangle leptocheilos.

Cerdic

Non omnis moriar (Horace)

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Most older ones I've seen don't look so great, enjoy them in those teenage years, so to speak, best as a slow grower, in my humble opinion.

Happy Gardening

Cheers,

Wal

Queensland, Australia.

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Lookn Beautiful Len :greenthumb: , these are imo when they "look their best", they may well look fantastic forever for you Len but here and in "many" Oz gardens the twist in the leaf ( some here did a full 360) was so extreme they became very untidy and had to face the chainsaw :)

Im sure "Yours Len" will look 'Fantastic Forever"

In the hybrid plant world , some are "Beauties" ( yours Len) and some are or become "Dudds" ( 7/10 here) and most Ive seen in Oz

Pete :)

Thanks Pete. I saw some ratty looking ones on here years ago. I also have seen some lanky ones in FL. I think the dry air here makes them fatter and more compact so we should be OK. I hope :)

Yes Len, I think this Dypsis hybrid will "keep" its winning looks in your climate for sure.

Cedric, re leaf twist , yes Lens is slight esp post 2 but post 1 already has some old leaves with a near 180 deg twist,( not in his newest though, which is a good sign) the 7 we cut out had very severe twists with all its leaves and ours where in "full sun", the 3 we "kept" are in quite filtered light, below is a pic of them today and the twist is only "very slight".

Edit.. Note, how Lens has the "good looking" Tomemtum on the petiole n back of rachis and "mine doesnt", yours Len is a much better breed.

Pete :)

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post-5709-0-41950800-1409803912_thumb.jp

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Lookn Beautiful Len :greenthumb: , these are imo when they "look their best", they may well look fantastic forever for you Len but here and in "many" Oz gardens the twist in the leaf ( some here did a full 360) was so extreme they became very untidy and had to face the chainsaw :)

Im sure "Yours Len" will look 'Fantastic Forever"

In the hybrid plant world , some are "Beauties" ( yours Len) and some are or become "Dudds" ( 7/10 here) and most Ive seen in Oz

Pete :)

Thanks Pete. I saw some ratty looking ones on here years ago. I also have seen some lanky ones in FL. I think the dry air here makes them fatter and more compact so we should be OK. I hope :)

Yes Len, I think this Dypsis hybrid will "keep" its winning looks in your climate for sure.

Cedric, re leaf twist , yes Lens is slight esp post 2 but post 1 already has some old leaves with a near 180 deg twist,( not in his newest though, which is a good sign) the 7 we cut out had very severe twists with all its leaves and ours where in "full sun", the 3 we "kept" are in quite filtered light, below is a pic of them today and the twist is only "very slight".

Edit.. Note, how Lens has the "good looking" Tomemtum on the petiole n back of rachis and "mine doesnt", yours Len is a much better breed.

Pete :)

Thanks Pete I didn't expect a picture so soon :) That first one looks very nice, I will be happy if mine turn out like this, light, elegant, tristichous crown, uniform in all parts and etc I think very very nice even if not robust. Is it still in a pot?

The other two Im not so fond, the arrangement of the leaves is a bit Piggeldy und Frederick. That shortened shaft almost like its got lastelliana in it.

Are all three of those from the same seed batch? Do you know anything about how they were done or just bought as hybrids as such?

Things grow here extremely fast in general. We have extreme precipitation, humidity and heat and then sigh a cooler dry season that seems all too short but the humidity stays around 60%. Anyway they will be lightly shaded for a quarter of the day at least as the sun goes behind a monster mountainous peak directly behind us after about 4 30-5pm, dry season 3 30pm. My leptocheilos are sky dusters already after six or seven years I forget but looking beutifull as ever. My decaryi was fast too but put on monster girth same time.

Cerdic

Non omnis moriar (Horace)

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Len, your three specimens look so different that every time I visit your garden I always think they're different palms. The one in your driveway on the left is my favorite.

I hope my Seabreeze cross will look like one of yours someday. It's looking very healthy and is definitely 2x to 3x the speed of other dypsis I have. It's tripled in size since last year.

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All I know is the ones I sold off were natural hybrids, not hand pollinated at all.

Zone 10a at best after 2007 AND 2013, on SW facing hill, 1 1/2 miles from coast in Oceanside, CA. 30-98 degrees, and 45-80deg. about 95% of the time.

"The great workman of nature is time."   ,  "Genius is nothing but a great aptitude for patience."

-George-Louis Leclerc de Buffon-

I do some experiments and learning in my garden with palms so you don't have to experience the pain! Look at my old threads to find various observations and tips!

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Those are all very fine specimens Len.

The one I have is doing fantastic and is a very handsome palm.

Jeffry Brusseau

"Cuesta Linda"

Vista, California

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Those are all very fine specimens Len.

The one I have is doing fantastic and is a very handsome palm.

Thanks Jeff. Post a picture of yours when you get a chance.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Matt, you have this cross? Any photos?

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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It's just a baby in a rabbit cage.

Matt Bradford

"Manambe Lavaka"

Spring Valley, CA (8.5 miles inland from San Diego Bay)

10B on the hill (635 ft. elevation)

9B in the canyon (520 ft. elevation)

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I love the first one Len, but the sensitive stuff that requires more work is kinda a turn off. If I had the first one it might not look as good. Isn't that a F2? Hah

Grateful to have what I have, Les amis de mes amis sont mes amis!

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I love the first one Len, but the sensitive stuff that requires more work is kinda a turn off. If I had the first one it might not look as good. Isn't that a F2? Hah

Just got word. F3. Supper stoked. :)

The first requires a lot of water and fertilizer like a Lepto here in Cali requires to look its best. I supplemental potassium and iron.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Do these transplant well? I have three in pots that I want in the ground to get them growing faster. But I am not ready to put them in their final spot. Will these transplant from spot to spot or should I just wait until the final spot is ready? Sorry if this is a thread hijack. These I also got from Seabreeze about a year ago. Three of them are growing at totally different rates in the exact same spot and in the same potting soil with the same care. Strange.

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Do these transplant well? I have three in pots that I want in the ground to get them growing faster. But I am not ready to put them in their final spot. Will these transplant from spot to spot or should I just wait until the final spot is ready? Sorry if this is a thread hijack. These I also got from Seabreeze about a year ago. Three of them are growing at totally different rates in the exact same spot and in the same potting soil with the same care. Strange.

Jason, I know of two people that have transplanted this cross and it sulked but grew out of it. PogoBob moved one that had just started trunking. I personally I would wait. It is always better to plant into the final resting spot.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Do these transplant well? I have three in pots that I want in the ground to get them growing faster. But I am not ready to put them in their final spot. Will these transplant from spot to spot or should I just wait until the final spot is ready? Sorry if this is a thread hijack. These I also got from Seabreeze about a year ago. Three of them are growing at totally different rates in the exact same spot and in the same potting soil with the same care. Strange.

Jason, I know of two people that have transplanted this cross and it sulked but grew out of it. PogoBob moved one that had just started trunking. I personally I would wait. It is always better to plant into the final resting spot.

Yeah they dig; I know of a wholesale nursery that has several in the field. They wouldn't be in the field if they didn't dig up well. Of course the palm only digs up as well as the digger! :winkie:

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I have six of these Tri-bears, two of which have more than five feet of trunk and fifteen or more feet overhead. There is enormous variation among the offspring of the cross. The way that genetic shuffling works (meiosis) which creates the reproductive products such as pollen leads to a vast combination of gene assortments and thus the wide range of phenotypes.

One easy way to understand this is if you take a couple with vastly different physical characteristics such as skin color, height, hair etc. and they have large number of children, you will find great variability in their offspring. This is because during egg and sperm production the genetic sorting can create great variability among the genetic traits carried in the reproductive products. Like looking parents will produce children looking much similar.

patrick

Bonita, California (San Diego)

Zone 10B

10 Year Low of 29 degrees

6 Miles from San Diego Bay

Mild winters, somewhat warm summers

10 Miles North of Mexico/USA Border

1 acre

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Patrick! You've gotta show us some pics! Your garden is awesome!

Matt Bradford

"Manambe Lavaka"

Spring Valley, CA (8.5 miles inland from San Diego Bay)

10B on the hill (635 ft. elevation)

9B in the canyon (520 ft. elevation)

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At the "end of the day", these Dypsis hybrids looks great in Len Geiger's beautiful gardens and we need to "all" be grateful when PTalkers "post pics" of Palms etc for "all" to view. Pics mean "So much more than , blah , blah, blah.

Lens Hybrids are "much better lookers" and far more appealing than any Ive had or seen here in Oz , so its pretty obvious these look better in Cali's climate.

To add a little blah, BUT a pic to go along with it is a pic showing the old base of 1 of these hybrids which is now host to Broms but check out how "Chunky" it was, I heard "many" years ago that the fastest that grew trunks like royals where actually Lepto x Mad, I sort of wish this "Monster" hybrid was still standing so I could show how "twisted" it was..

Ok enough negative.

Len, thanks for "sharing" pics of your "good looking" hybrids and Cedric, after this thread I think its "overtime" that you shared some pics of Palms you are growing in HongKong/ Sth Africa, I and Im sure "all" here on PT would "love " to see your garden/s. Thank you in advance.

All best to "all"

Pete :)

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Thanks Pete. I appreciate the comments.

Pete I have noticed when you cut out old palms you leave the stump. Is it solely for a Brom placement or some other reason? I always have to dig out the stump or the thing will be in my garden for decades as things decompose slower here in our climate.

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Thanks Pete. I appreciate the comments.

Pete I have noticed when you cut out old palms you leave the stump. Is it solely for a Brom placement or some other reason? I always have to dig out the stump or the thing will be in my garden for decades as things decompose slower here in our climate.

Your welcome Len.

Re leaving the stump, a few reasons Len .

Broms or the like to have a new spot.

Our property is 20acres so plenty of room.

Plus some Laziness? :)

Pete

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Just a quiki, my tribear is completely recovered from being moved 2yrs ago, and has 7 new twisted bitchin leaves.It"s about 15ft tal and has about 5ft ringed trunk. I'd post pics but I ain't got the pacience required for this antiquated site. Or maybe I'm too antiquated to get with it here!

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Robert de Jong

San Clemente, CA

 

Willowbrook Nursery

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  • 8 months later...

I thought this was interesting. It is almost like a leaf imprint you find on Agaves. Nice tiger striping. Forms from rain flowing off leaflets. 

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post-649-0-05221200-1432584596_thumb.jpg

  • Upvote 1

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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