How to profit from the melting greenland ice sheet

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

OK, all you guys managing your portfolios, even if you don't believe in global warming, you can make money with it. But as global warming is more and more an established fact, how do you make money with it? Looks like some mutual funds are starting to use investment strategies that take into account the effects of global warming, both in terms of policy and actual effects on the globe.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2014/04/02/how-to-profit-from-the-melting-greenland-ice-sheet/

This Forbes article comes in the wake of the latest news that the Greenland ice sheet has now been found to be melting at record levels, far worse than what was expected. This ice sheet alone would lead to an 25 feet rise in sea levels world wide if it melted completely. See http://www.climatecentral.org/news/new-greenland-ice-melt-fuels-sea-level-rise-concerns-17187,%C2'>

[redant]

Most of my investment experience came from trading commodities, when I first started trading stocks one of my criteria was if I the company was on the forefront of something positive for the world, fuel cells, solar, things like that. It was a blood bath for me investing in those companies back in 2000, I don't know if their time has finally arrived but green portfolios may make you fell like your doing good for the world but they are not the best for investing (least not from past experience).

Edited April 7, 2014 by redant

[Jerry@TreeZoo]

The stock market may be short term emotional it is ultimately long term rational, whereas this global warming issue is wholly emotional and irrational. Investing in an emotional, irrational fashion will lead to ruin.

This investment idea in the Forbes article tries to put some rationality behind its investment ideas. Nothing wrong with adding it as a little diversification, just don't put all your eggs in one basket.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Most of my investment experience came from trading commodities, when I first started trading stocks one of my criteria was if I the company was on the forefront of something positive for the world, fuel cells, solar, things like that. It was a blood bath for me investing in those companies back in 2000, I don't know if their time has finally arrived but green portfolios may make you fell like your doing good for the world but they are not the best for investing (least not from past experience).

You didn't read the article, the fund described in the article isn't investing in "green companies". It's investing in companies that will profit from the greenhouse effect. That includes a lot of non-green companies.

The stock market may be short term emotional it is ultimately long term rational, whereas this global warming issue is wholly emotional and irrational. Investing in an emotional, irrational fashion will lead to ruin.

This investment idea in the Forbes article tries to put some rationality behind its investment ideas. Nothing wrong with adding it as a little diversification, just don't put all your eggs in one basket.

The two sides arguing away over what is causing climate change are indeed quite irrational, but the regulations are real, and the climate change itself is also real. The point is that you can leverage this and make money with it.

[redant]

Yeah I read it all, just hard as in individual to figure out what companies are going to benefit from an aquatic world, I was just pointing out the green aspect. Google, one of my tech favorites has been a big investor in solar so I guess I'm semi green.

[Funkthulhu]

I was just going to look at a topo-map and buy land that is currently at ~25 feet above sea-level.

Water rises, sell land, Profit!

[DoomsDave]

Jerry, I know you're serious.

Love ya for that.

But . . .

How do you explain the loss of glaciers? And the eroding ice mass of Greenland and Antartica?

[_Keith]

Jerry, I know you're serious.

Love ya for that.

But . . .

How do you explain the loss of glaciers? And the eroding ice mass of Greenland and Antartica?

Aliens are changing the climate to make it more habitable for them prior to invasion. Sheesh, I thought everyone knew that one.

[Kim]

Maybe Kevin Costner will collect some more royalties for a re-release....?

[Jerry@TreeZoo]

How do you explain the loss of glaciers? And the eroding ice mass of Greenland and Antartica?

I don't explain the loss of glaciers or the Greenland ice. Just because climate can change locally, it does not mean it changes globally. In fact, the antarctic ice is growing.

And there is, of course, that alien thing.

[Phoenikakias]

Jerry, I know you're serious.

Love ya for that.

But . . .

How do you explain the loss of glaciers? And the eroding ice mass of Greenland and Antartica?

Aliens are changing the climate to make it more habitable for them prior to invasion. Sheesh, I thought everyone knew that one.

It is called 'marsification' of earth!

[DoomsDave]

How do you explain the loss of glaciers? And the eroding ice mass of Greenland and Antartica?

I don't explain the loss of glaciers or the Greenland ice. Just because climate can change locally, it does not mean it changes globally. In fact, the antarctic ice is growing.

And there is, of course, that alien thing.

Hmm.

Glaciers are receding dramatically all over the world.

Glacier National Park in Montana is down to about 10% of its glaciers. Glaciers in the Himalayas are also melting.

And, where do you get your numbers about Antarctica?

Kindly advise.

[Zeeth]

How do you explain the loss of glaciers? And the eroding ice mass of Greenland and Antartica?

I don't explain the loss of glaciers or the Greenland ice. Just because climate can change locally, it does not mean it changes globally. In fact, the antarctic ice is growing.

And there is, of course, that alien thing.

Hmm.

Glaciers are receding dramatically all over the world.

Glacier National Park in Montana is down to about 10% of its glaciers. Glaciers in the Himalayas are also melting.

And, where do you get your numbers about Antarctica?

Kindly advise.

The Antarctic sea ice is growing, but the land ice is shrinking quickly. It's basically a red herring.

[Funkthulhu]

...I know this is at least the 3rd (maybe 4th) time I've explained this.

Increased rate of, and volumetricly astounding amounts of, land-based Antarctic continental ice melting.

Melt water is Fresh water, Fresh water freezes faster and easier that Salt water.

Melt water dilutes sea water around Antarctica.

Sea water is now less salty and therefore freezes much faster and to an extent further away from the edge of the continent as has been seen recently.

Sea ice does not change sea-level and fluctuates in extent wildly from year to year, but recently has given the perception of increased total ice on the planet.

In fact, the wider extent of sea-ice around Antarctica is evidence of increased continental ice melting.

Ta Da!

[Zeeth]

...I know this is at least the 3rd (maybe 4th) time I've explained this.

Increased rate of, and volumetricly astounding amounts of, land-based Antarctic continental ice melting.

Melt water is Fresh water, Fresh water freezes faster and easier that Salt water.

Melt water dilutes sea water around Antarctica.

Sea water is now less salty and therefore freezes much faster and to an extent further away from the edge of the continent as has been seen recently.

Sea ice does not change sea-level and fluctuates in extent wildly from year to year, but recently has given the perception of increased total ice on the planet.

In fact, the wider extent of sea-ice around Antarctica is evidence of increased continental ice melting.

Ta Da!

Also the ozone hole above the Antarctic allows more heat to radiate away into space in the winter, which also leads to the fact that almost all of the Antarctic sea ice melts in the summer.

[DoomsDave]

If the ice all or nearly all melts, we could have rising seas very fast, if my experience in the far frozen north is any guide.

If we get a 300 foot rise, my place could become oceanfront property, while many others are literally underwater, whatever their mortgage status. (La Habra is 299 feet about sea level, and I'm on a hill above it.)

[_Keith]

So, for those concerned about this, what are YOU doing right now to help.

1. Electric car?
2. Only driving when absolutely necessary?
3. Carpool whenever possible?
4. Only electric yard equipment?
5. Solar hot water heater?
6. Solar or wind electricity for the house?
7. All of your bulbs changed to CFL?
8. Only turn on lights after dark?
9. Keeping AC and Heat off except for temp extremes?
10. Always buy the most energy efficient appliances?
11. Replace appliances older than 5 years?
12. Only run the dishwasher when it is full?
13. Only wash clothes and dishes with cold water?
14. Only use recycled paper products?
15. Only buy bulk products to save on packaging?
16. Don't use bottled water?
17. Compost all decomposable items?
18. Participate in local recycling programs?
19. Build you house with green or recycled materials?
20. Re-insulate your house?
21. Turn off all electronic devices when not in use?
22. Unplug electronics chargers and other phantom loads when not in use?
23. Keep you tires at the maximum stated pressure?
24. Eat local foods?
25. Buy local products?
26. Buy less things?

These are the ones that pop up the most on sites across the Internet. Post with the numbers of the ones you have done or where you are making a serious concerted daily effort to do your part to address the issue.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

So, for those concerned about this, what are YOU doing right now to help.

• Electric car?
• Only driving when absolutely necessary?
• Carpool whenever possible?
• Only electric yard equipment?
• Solar hot water heater?
• Solar or wind electricity for the house?
• All of your bulbs changed to CFL?
• Only turn on lights after dark?
• Keeping AC and Heat off except for temp extremes?
• Always buy the most energy efficient appliances?
• Replace appliances older than 5 years?
• Only run the dishwasher when it is full?
• Only wash clothes and dishes with cold water?
• Only use recycled paper products?
• Only buy bulk products to save on packaging?
• Don't use bottled water?
• Compost all decomposable items?
• Participate in local recycling programs?
• Build you house with green or recycled materials?
• Re-insulate your house?
• Turn off all electronic devices when not in use?
• Unplug electronics chargers and other phantom loads when not in use?
• Keep you tires at the maximum stated pressure?
• Eat local foods?
• Buy local products?
• Buy less things?

These are the ones that pop up the most on sites across the Internet. Post with the numbers of the ones you have done or where you are making a serious concerted daily effort to do your part to address the issue.

If you're investment strategy relies on the greenhouse effect, where's the incentive to stop it?

I've got electric car and solar, CFLs and electric garden tools. My incentive was monetary, you have to like spending extra money if you choose to not do these things.

[_Keith]

Although I am not concerned about climate change, but I do quite a lot of those things just because I think it is the right thing to do.

[DoomsDave]

So, for those concerned about this, what are YOU doing right now to help.

1. NO - Electric car?
2. Only driving when absolutely necessary?
3. NO - Carpool whenever possible?
4. Only electric yard equipment?
5. NO -Solar hot water heater?
6. NO -Solar or wind electricity for the house?
7. All of your bulbs changed to CFL?
8. Only turn on lights after dark?
9. NO -Keeping AC and Heat off except for temp extremes?
10. Always buy the most energy efficient appliances?
11. NO -Replace appliances older than 5 years?
12. Only run the dishwasher when it is full?
13. Only wash clothes YES and dishes NO with cold water?
14. NO -Only use recycled paper products?
15. NO -Only buy bulk products to save on packaging?
16. NO -Don't use bottled water?
17. Compost all decomposable items?
18. Participate in local recycling programs?
19. N/A - Build you house with green or recycled materials?
20. Re-insulate your house?
21. Turn off all electronic devices when not in use?
22. Unplug electronics chargers and other phantom loads when not in use?
23. Keep you tires at the maximum stated pressure?
24. Eat local foods?
25. Buy local products?
26. Buy less things?

These are the ones that pop up the most on sites across the Internet. Post with the numbers of the ones you have done or where you are making a serious concerted daily effort to do your part to address the issue.

I was surprised at how many I actually do.

Does anyone actually wash dishes with cold water? Clothes, yes, dishes no.

[Kim]

That is definitely an American list. Anyone wishing to play devil's advocate could have some fun with it.

1. Electric car -- what? You own a car? And the batteries? Where do you dispose of them?

2. Define "absolutely necessary". Is it EVER absolutely necessary to drive if you live in a place with public transportation or sidewalks?

3. See #2

4. What? You own power equipment? Get a mule or an ox.

5. Solar water heater? You heat your water? WHY??? Look ahead to #13. Don't be a wimp, take a marine shower.

6. Electricity? Elitist concept!

7, 8, 9, 10, 11 and 12: See #6 Especially #9, heat and AC? Who do you think you are?

13. Take me to the river...

etc. etc.

19. "Build your house..." now we are ROFL! Recycle! Live in an existing house!

People in other parts of the world might really get a kick out of this list. Just sayin'... Oh, do you every FLY in a JET? That increases your carbon footprint significantly. Oh, right, "only when absolutely necessary".

Seriously, I do a number of things on the list, but we privileged folks in over-developed nations have a lot of blind spots when it comes to self-examination.

[redant]

I try not to eat to many beans or to much broccoli.

http://epa.gov/climatechange/ghgemissions/gases/ch4.html

[_Keith]

That is definitely an American list. Anyone wishing to play devil's advocate could have some fun with it.

1. Electric car -- what? You own a car? And the batteries? Where do you dispose of them?

2. Define "absolutely necessary". Is it EVER absolutely necessary to drive if you live in a place with public transportation or sidewalks?

3. See #2

4. What? You own power equipment? Get a mule or an ox.

5. Solar water heater? You heat your water? WHY??? Look ahead to #13. Don't be a wimp, take a marine shower.

6. Electricity? Elitist concept!

7, 8, 9, 10, 11 and 12: See #6 Especially #9, heat and AC? Who do you think you are?

13. Take me to the river...

etc. etc.

19. "Build your house..." now we are ROFL! Recycle! Live in an existing house!

People in other parts of the world might really get a kick out of this list. Just sayin'... Oh, do you every FLY in a JET? That increases your carbon footprint significantly. Oh, right, "only when absolutely necessary".

Seriously, I do a number of things on the list, but we privileged folks in over-developed nations have a lot of blind spots when it comes to self-examination.

Not my list for sure. I just hit a couple dozen list on the net to see what the climate change preachers were telling the congregation they should be doing.

[Funkthulhu]

Nice list, another really good one would be to eat less beef. . . They fart a lot and methane is something like 13 times more potent a greenhouse gas than CO2, and it degrades into CO2 later in its cycle.

Of course, if you're going to really beat out all of these methods in one fell swoop: Don't have kids. You've just eliminated infinite amounts of CO2 from being released by future generations.

[_Keith]

Nice list, another really good one would be to eat less beef. . . They fart a lot and methane is something like 13 times more potent a greenhouse gas than CO2, and it degrades into CO2 later in its cycle.

Of course, if you're going to really beat out all of these methods in one fell swoop: Don't have kids. You've just eliminated infinite amounts of CO2 from being released by future generations.

I did see the don't eat animal on a couple of list, but only put the ones I was seeing over and over.

Now, I didn't see don't have children, lol.

[Funkthulhu]

Nice list, another really good one would be to eat less beef. . . They fart a lot and methane is something like 13 times more potent a greenhouse gas than CO2, and it degrades into CO2 later in its cycle.

Of course, if you're going to really beat out all of these methods in one fell swoop: Don't have kids. You've just eliminated infinite amounts of CO2 from being released by future generations.

I did see the don't eat animal on a couple of list, but only put the ones I was seeing over and over.

Now, I didn't see don't have children, lol.

I Joke that I can drive a tank to work, leave the windows open with the AC and the heat on at home, and eat/drink/smoke/burn/dump/spill anything I want, and if I don't have any offspring I still have a smaller long-term carbon footprint than that guy with the prius and 3 kids...

[redant]

Nice list, another really good one would be to eat less beef. . . They fart a lot and methane is something like 13 times more potent a greenhouse gas than CO2, and it degrades into CO2 later in its cycle.

Of course, if you're going to really beat out all of these methods in one fell swoop: Don't have kids. You've just eliminated infinite amounts of CO2 from being released by future generations.

I did see the don't eat animal on a couple of list, but only put the ones I was seeing over and over.

Now, I didn't see don't have children, lol.

I Joke that I can drive a tank to work, leave the windows open with the AC and the heat on at home, and eat/drink/smoke/burn/dump/spill anything I want, and if I don't have any offspring I still have a smaller long-term carbon footprint than that guy with the prius and 3 kids...

Clearly the best way to reduce your CF.

[DoomsDave]

Imagine the carbon footprint of the Duggars . . . . .

[Alicehunter2000]

Dang.....somebody beat me to the "Waterworld " reference.

[Umbrae]

we grow a lot of our own food, I'd say 1/3 at least.

we grow almost all of our own meat or hunt it and all of our own eggs using all local material, except for some broilers, those come in from hatcheries.

lots of composting, mulching and recycling with a healthy dose re purposing thrown in on top.

some staple items that we can't grow our selves we do purchase in bulk, especially ammunition.

have added insulation to the house and also have been planting lots of trees to shade areas around the house lowering ambient temps and blocking prevailing winter winds.

Driving has been cut in half at least.

I got into sustainability living/growing after spending some time in some pretty unsavory areas of the world where there was no other option.

I still indulge in creature comforts of all kinds but try and make up for it where I can, sometimes my wife has to pull me back from getting too grizzly adams with it.

[JEFF IN MODESTO]

I've been doing my ancestry stuff and after a lot of digging