Dypsis Decipiens Gradual Decline...

[BeaumontTropics]

hey all,

i have a "friend" who wishes to remain anonymous. He has planted and unsuccessfully (to this point) tried to grow several dypsis decipiens. His climate is identical to mine, lets call it a harsh 9b, more likely 9a. We had an abnormally long and cold winter here this year, with a low temp as low as 24F. It didn't last that long at that temp, but several weeks we were below 30F at night. In the summers we get up to 102F, but mostly stay in the mid to high nineties.

Here is the problem with the dypsis decline. It doesn't "frost" burn like many of the other tropicals I've tried to grow. Rather, my buddies dypsis will start browning right at the very tip of one of the fronds, work its way along the petioles, until eventually the entire leaflet is brown, but it only does this one frond at a time, until eventually, the fronds have browned off at a faster rate than a new spear can regenerate and kung-pow, into the green trash can it goes.

As cold hardy as many of the experts have claimed this palm to be, and just by the way it declines, i don't think it's cold that's killing it. My suspicion is a soil/hydration/drainage issue? But i know as much about palms as i do about hydraulic fracturing. (not much in case you were wondering.)

Now all these decipiens, call it, 5 maybe 6, in total have all suffered the same fate. All of these decipiens were purchased at different times (some years apart), from different growers in different areas of southern california. Also, they have varied greatly in size, from a 1 gallon tree liner up to a 24 in box massive palm, and all are doing the same thing.

Please offer up any useful advice, my friend is getting really frustrated and I'm beginning to grow tired of having to talk him down off the ledge. (kidding of course.) thanks palmers!!

FINS UP!

-eric

[Kailua_Krish]

Thats really unfortunate Mine is still growing quite well in the low 9a here in Florida but our climate is nothing like yours so I dont know if that helps at all.

[Sutter Bob]

Eric,

Do you have them out in the open or under some canopy?

Do they dry out in the winter?

How much do you water them in the summer?

I have similar temperature extremes here but presumably more winter rainfall/humidity.

I have four growing here - the two with the least cover took a hit this winter but are growing again.

One by the south side of my house and another with moderate cover look fine.

As you probably know Jeff in Modesto has had very good experience growing this palm.

[Jastin]

How are his other palms? I would do a soil test and drainage test. Brown tips suggest root rot. Is he trying them in different parts of the garden?

[BeaumontTropics]

Eric,

Do you have them out in the open or under some canopy?

Do they dry out in the winter?

How much do you water them in the summer?

I have similar temperature extremes here but presumably more winter rainfall/humidity.

I have four growing here - the two with the least cover took a hit this winter but are growing again.

One by the south side of my house and another with moderate cover look fine.

As you probably know Jeff in Modesto has had very good experience growing this palm.

Sutter,

his are out in the open relatively speaking, barring the one in the 24" box that remains in the box under a patio cover. He recently purchased the big boy just before winter and wanted to acclimate it to beaumont from its previous location in san diego, which, was told, was recently received from hawaii. he waters them very little in winter, and probably once a week or so during our hot, arid summer months.

[BeaumontTropics]

How are his other palms? I would do a soil test and drainage test. Brown tips suggest root rot. Is he trying them in different parts of the garden?

His other palms are outstanding! His Bismarkcia planted some ten feet within one of his decipiens, had the same amount of soil preparation, i.e. dug down deep, added gypsum, let it drain, repeated process, etc. He mixed with probably a 50/50 balance of our native heavily alkaline soil with a "palm mix" from a big box store, in addition to organic amendments and pumice for additional drainage. He has had them planted throughout his garden, some areas more shaded and protected, some areas more sun exposure but less protection etc. He just can't seem to get one of these guys to go. He's got Phoenix Rupicola, and a Parajubea Coicoides that show signs of winter damage but always ultimately recover and they are (at least I thought) to be considerably less cold hardy than a dyspsis decipiens. Heck, he's got a dypsis baronii that's doing pretty well. I really appreciate your guys' input, thanks!

-Eric

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

I've seen Jeff's dypsis in Modesto, he only gets to 24F occasionally, but he does get solid 9b style frost every year somewhere in the 27F range. He should comment rather than us commenting for him, but his dypsis is really nice.

I have a lawn in my lower garden that is the only place that experiences any significant frost. My garden is 10a but a foot above the lawn might be more like 9b as the thing is covered with white frost several nights a year. But it's probably not low enough to cause an issue for a decipiens. I put in a tiny d. decipiens plant next to that lawn, just to test the hardiness. It's been in there 3 years and seems to get bigger every year, but the tips did look kinda fried. I've never seen the tip fry progress further, it just stays at the tip. It's in full sun. Note that the "frying" seems unrelated to frost damage as the new frond coming out was never exposed to anything below 40F and it also has the brown tip burn.

I think the tiny thing doesn't like cold soil. My recommendation is to start out with a bigger plant. This one was a tiny little thing when planted and it's a miracle it's even survived.

[BeaumontTropics]

here's a few pics of the dypsis' decline...

[BeaumontTropics]

[BeaumontTropics]

heres the first pic rotated correclty..

[BeaumontTropics]

last one... this must be an acclimatization issue yes? it's the only thing I can think of given it is not planted, has been under a patio canopy, has great draining soil and has not been watered very frequently given most of the time he's had it have been during the colder months of the year.

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

That thing belongs in the ground. What you are seing are root problems, probably the typical results of cold soil. The palm is simply loosing lower leaves, as the roots weaken through Winter. The roots are exposed to the elements because it's not planted in the ground, and you are going to see decline after Winter.

My chamadorea plumosas do that, they slowly loose lower leaves through the Winter, but as soon as the soil warms up, they crank and make up for the loss.

Dypsis decipiens is known for its root problems. The sooner you get it into the ground and get it established with good soil drainage and preferably drier soil during the cold season, the sooner it will acclimatize and take off.

[WestCoastGal]

Just a guess here and don't have this palm. Contemplated it though. I'm in a similar zone, and I cut back on our winter watering like it sounds like he does. However, when I know it's suppose to go really low I will go out and give my palms some water during the day if it hasn't rained recently before the cold snap. I thought I had read somewhere that you want to provide your plants with moisture to keep the cell structure from damage as you are approaching a really stressful low. Also don't cut off frost damage until you've gotten past those cold temps. So far no problems, but my palms are more cold hardy than his D decipiens.

Not being in the ground, not getting much water and then getting assaulted by below freezing temps, just may be too much. I'd sure hate to lose a 24-inch box guy.

[Phoenikakias]

here's a few pics of the dypsis' decline...IMG_1328.jpg

That DD of yours seems to me having leaves grown in three rows, if you get my implication....

[BeaumontTropics]

here's a few pics of the dypsis' decline...IMG_1328.jpg

That DD of yours seems to me having leaves grown in three rows, if you get my implication....

luckily, it's just a dypsis decipiens and not a celebrity.

[Phoenikakias]

http://www.palmtalk.org/forum/index.php?/topic/36589-dypsis-decipiens/

[Sutter Bob]

Again, my experience isn't great, but my suggestion would also be to get it into the ground.

I would probably use frost blankets for the next two or three winters.

I would fertilize periodically and water like heck during the summer.