42 replies to this topic

[displaced_floridian]

I'm a native Floridian (hence my name) and have always been a weather buff. When I look at weather in HI and S Fl I notice a lot of similarities. Temps are similar with highs in the upper 70s to upper 80s. Lows are generally in the 60s and 70s--except for the FL cold snaps . Also, the wind in both places seems to be from the E to NE a good part of the time. In Hawaii they are called Trade winds. Are not these perisitent E-NE winds in S Florida also Tradewinds--even though they are more frequently interrupted by cold fronts in Winter?

Edited by displaced_floridian, 15 November 2011 - 02:32 PM.

[Dypsisdean]

You can read up, and see a map, on the trade winds HERE

As you can see, the trades flow almost uninterrupted across the oceans (and Hawaii), but are apparently influenced and altered (as around Florida) by some of the land masses.

[Mandrew968]

Rainfall is very different and we are much hotter, I think.

[amazondk]

Since Hawaii has mountains there is a big difference to S. Florida. The only hills in S. Florida are the sanitary landfill mounds. Altought it snows in Hawaii it is not because of cold fronts, but altitude. Hawaii just has a lot more complex climatic mix. Where S. Florida is the same all over.

dk

[bgl]

Having lived in south Florida for many years and now in Hawaii for the last 16 years I have my own thoughts on this. The way I see it, there are more differences than similarities. Humidity is much more oppressive in FL. Just no comparison. I am referring to the summer months. Winter in south FL is as perfect as perfect can be. 95% of the time. And that remaining 5% - when one of those Canadian cold fronts come rolling through! Of course, nothing like that here. And there is nothing in FL to compare to the tradewinds we have here in HI. A summer afternoon here, especially if you're a bit higher up (I'm at 800 ft) is very pleasant. Upper 80s with that pleasant constant breeze. A pleasant summer afternoon in south FL is a bit of an oxymoron. The closest would be RIGHT after one of those heavy afternoon showers. But other than that, the combination of heat and humidity puts FL in a whole different category than HI. And not a good one.

[amazondk]

Having lived in south Florida for many years and now in Hawaii for the last 16 years I have my own thoughts on this. The way I see it, there are more differences than similarities. Humidity is much more oppressive in FL. Just no comparison. I am referring to the summer months. Winter in south FL is as perfect as perfect can be. 95% of the time. And that remaining 5% - when one of those Canadian cold fronts come rolling through! Of course, nothing like that here. And there is nothing in FL to compare to the tradewinds we have here in HI. A summer afternoon here, especially if you're a bit higher up (I'm at 800 ft) is very pleasant. Upper 80s with that pleasant constant breeze. A pleasant summer afternoon in south FL is a bit of an oxymoron. The closest would be RIGHT after one of those heavy afternoon showers. But other than that, the combination of heat and humidity puts FL in a whole different category than HI. And not a good one.

That sums things up quite well Bo. I also have lived in S.. Florida and the summers can be quite oppressive. Since I now live in a place where the temperature varies from hot to less hot I have sort of a different base of comparison. The nights in the summer in S. Florida are more oppressive than the nights here though. The rainy season is back, so things are less steamy around these parts.

dk

[Ray Tampa]

I guess "oppressive" is a relative term. As a native Floridian, I wouldn't trade those mid summer Florida days for the world. There's no better feeling than going outside to work in the garden and you're sweating before you even get started. There's a cleansing feeling about it. Sorry but humidity is not a bad word in my vocabulary.

The number of palms that can be grown in Hawaii vs. south Florida are too few to justify a move (for me) from one place to another. It's a challenge to grow palms in Florida's often inhospitable climate. I'm not sure what I'd do if those challenges were suddenly gone. I might actually get bored if every palm planted grew unchecked.

Hawaii is my favorite place to visit. I'd love to have a second place there but at this stage of my life, could never make it my primary residence. When I'm older, retired and prefer to stay home, being more remotely removed from urban life might be an option. For now, it's not. I can wet my palm growing appetite sufficiently in the SUB-tropics.

[Mandrew968]

I guess "oppressive" is a relative term. As a native Floridian, I wouldn't trade those mid summer Florida days for the world. There's no better feeling than going outside to work in the garden and you're sweating before you even get started. There's a cleansing feeling about it. Sorry but humidity is not a bad word in my vocabulary.

The number of palms that can be grown in Hawaii vs. south Florida are too few to justify a move (for me) from one place to another. It's a challenge to grow palms in Florida's often inhospitable climate. I'm not sure what I'd do if those challenges were suddenly gone. I might actually get bored if every palm planted grew unchecked.

Hawaii is my favorite place to visit. I'd love to have a second place there but at this stage of my life, could never make it my primary residence. When I'm older, retired and prefer to stay home, being more remotely removed from urban life might be an option. For now, it's not. I can wet my palm growing appetite sufficiently in the SUB-tropics.

Well said! I enjoy the sweating too--I love South Florida and the many palms I can grow.

[bgl]

There is enough humidity here in Hawaii to satisfy anyone. You just go outside for five minutes and MOVE and you WILL be sweating. And "oppressive" is obviously subjective. But for someone who has not experienced both climates I realize it may be difficult to understand and appreciate the differences. One crucial, and very telling difference, is how common air conditioning is. Here in this area, nobody has a/c in their house. Try that in Florida! As far as I'm concerned, that's the difference between relatively pleasant humidity and unpleasant humidity.

[Jerry@TreeZoo]

Having spent a little bit of time in Owhyhee, I would say that sea level climates are very similar. It is hot and muggy in Hilo, Honolulu and Lahaina. Get a few hundred feet up and there is more breeze and cooler temps. One thing I noticed in the Lahaina, Maui area is the misty rains. Lahaina is in a relatively dry area but with the cloud cover and the frequent mysty rains, plants don't transpire all their water as quickly as sunny South Florida. Volcanic soil is much better than our sand but that is a whole nuther discussion.

[Ray Tampa]

"unpleasant humidity" - Bo, for me there is no such thing.

I also like the many 90+F degree days we get. Call me crazy but it's in my blood.

[bgl]

There's no right or wrong and each to his own, and it's all about perception. I am simply expressing my own opinion, based on my experience.

[tank]

I guess "oppressive" is a relative term. As a native Floridian, I wouldn't trade those mid summer Florida days for the world. There's no better feeling than going outside to work in the garden and you're sweating before you even get started. There's a cleansing feeling about it. Sorry but humidity is not a bad word in my vocabulary.

The number of palms that can be grown in Hawaii vs. south Florida are too few to justify a move (for me) from one place to another. It's a challenge to grow palms in Florida's often inhospitable climate. I'm not sure what I'd do if those challenges were suddenly gone. I might actually get bored if every palm planted grew unchecked.

Hawaii is my favorite place to visit. I'd love to have a second place there but at this stage of my life, could never make it my primary residence. When I'm older, retired and prefer to stay home, being more remotely removed from urban life might be an option. For now, it's not. I can wet my palm growing appetite sufficiently in the SUB-tropics.

I feel exactly the same. I function much better in the 90+F mid summer days than in even the relatively mild winters we get up here in N. Florida.

[Jeff Searle]

Give me 90 degree days with night time temp's in the lower 80's, high humidity and I'm a happy camper. And...while working in the yard, add a nice sprinkle of rain and I'm loving it. No lightning or thunder though. Don't mind a bit sweating all day, and actually when the cooler weather arrives, I'm already thinking about springtime. I guess that's why we live where we live.

[paulgila]

why,jeff...that is so....gosh danged beautiful...i love ya,man. (sob)

[displaced_floridian]

According to this map S FL is within the Tropical Easterlies
or Tradewind belt. At 25.8 N, Miami is S of the subtropicsl ridge which centers around 30 *N.

http://www.newmedias...rade_Winds.html

Edited by displaced_floridian, 17 November 2011 - 07:55 PM.

[happ]

My experience is that Hawaii has lower humidity in summer than Florida but winters are more humid\ warmer in the islands.

[Dakotafl]

I live in south brevard county and it sure seems like we have northeast trade winds but IDK, Not as constant but on many days in the winter we have a pleasant northeast breeze.

Then after a cold front when the wind shifts coming from the NE its cloudy and cool but not cold at night.

[Rick Santos]

Nothing against the original poster, but I am a tropical continent guy myself. There is more to do, more options, more protection from tidal waves, etc. I feel MUCH safer that I could travel hundreds of miles INLAND to avoid disaster and also less lonely not being on a tiny island in a remote area.

I could see other parts of the world easily, without flying. I could never live in Hawaii, or even worse, smaller islands. It feels like you are all alone in the center of nowhere to me . Puerto Rico is similar. That is all there is and you're stuck.


Florida is at least attacjed to the mainland. I think better comparisons would be Hanoi, Manaus, parts of Africa, etc. to Miami vs the small Hawaiin islands . My experience was I was always trying to compare Miami with an ISLAND such as Puerto Rico in my case. I should have been comparing it to a large tropical continental land mass. Miami vs the borderline tropical parts of South Africa is a much better comparison, I think. The Miami Metro Zoo looks very South African , especially the elephant exhibits. Very similar latitude .


To me, islands are more humid. Sure Miami is humid, but not as much so as Puerto Rico, and in September to November it is AWESOME- just dry enough.

My pet peeve is those phony, stupid and unrealistic Sandals commercials, where everything is doctored up to look "really nice" . No place look so phony. The real tropics are beautiful but rugged. They perpetuate the myth that tropical places look like Caribbean islands, Hawaii, the island life etc. ( and not only that but a Hawaii and Caribbean on steroids ) .

I was having a conversation with someone who went on a Sandals vacation and I told them the Congo is as tropical as it gets, and they actually said to me " Congo is tropical ???????? But it's a jungle".

The general public has this idea what tropical is- and it usually means island - Castaway movie scenario etc.




Give me a good African Baobab tree, Okavango Delta, or Manuas anyday and I am content , I say . LOL !

To me, Africa, Thailand, Hanoi, and Manaus, and the Amazonian area of Brazil are far prettier than Hawaii , Puerto Rico or any other one of those tiny islands.

This is my personal preference , that's all.

Edited by Rick Santos, 21 November 2011 - 12:00 PM.

[Rick Santos]

I forgot to add this: In my own journey comparing Miami to truly tropical places I have come to realize I should compare like to like. In other words, I should compare the Everglades to another tropical swamp, NOT El Yunque. That was my mistake. There are many tropical places that look MUCH more like Miami than either Hawaii or Puerto Rico or those typical tropical island places. I've always liked the look of Miami's flora.




Flying back from Puerto Rico to Miami in late September , I can honestly say Miami had the nicer weather and better "feel" to me. The sky was clear and the humdity noticably less than Puerto Rico. Puerto Rico and other islands I was on have a SMOTHERING humidity that makes it diffuclt to breathe just standing around.

Hanoi is exactly Hawaii's latitude and truly tropical - but it gets much colder because of the HUGE Asian continental land masses above it.

Miami was better than I was giving it credit for. I was really, really harsh on it in the past. I guess it is possible these continental tropical places still beat Miami, but at least it is much more fair of a comparison.

Puerto Rico is warmer than it should be for its latitude. Belize is not as warm .

Edited by Rick Santos, 21 November 2011 - 03:44 PM.

[amazondk]

Rick,

Since you mentioned Manaus I thought I would comment. Living here is much like living on an island. Aside from driving to Venezuela, over a good streatch of bad roads the only way in or out is by plane or boat. The nearest road link to Southern Brazil is in Porto Velho, Rondonia south of Manaus a 1 hour plane flight. And, then it is 3,000 kms by car to Sao Paulo. Manaus is a city now of 2 million with crazy traffic, and most of the other problems of the rest of the country, urban violance for example. But, in a 30 minute drive from town you are surrounded by wilderness. A bit different in this respect from being an actual island. But, the disconnect with the rest of the country is quite similar to what one would feel in Hawaii as to distance. Here you sort of look at your location as 5 hours from Miami and 3 1/2 hours from São Paulo. One of the most popular destinations for people from here to go is Miami. And, a lot of people from here and the rest of Brazil are buying homes in South Florida. Brazil is the largest investor in South Florida today. Brazilians look at Miami as a place where the poice works fairly well, where public services work, where the streets are not full of holes, and you can get an inexpensive meal in a good restaurant. In fact S. Florida does have some similarities to an island as there is pretty much nothing but swamp, city, and the beach. And, a long drive north to get anywhere.

Anyway as Joe Basstardi says, be happy with your weather, it is the only one yoiu have. I like the climate here fine. I enjoy getting up every morning and sitting on my deck having a cup of coffee with the same temperature, every day of the year. Six AM is a great time of day here.

Ray, I guess you would love the climate here. It is always hot and humid.

dk

[ariscott]

Interesting conversation... I haven't been to both places... so I can't speak for any of them. But, I always like the climate/weather in general. And from the look it, Florida has probably closer climate to where I live except for the freezing 5% of the time and probably a lot dryer in winter (or we call it dry season).

Each to their own.... for sure. I am a child of the tropics... I spent most of my life in the tropics except for 4 years of Uni & 3 years in Brisbane. I have to say, humidity doesn't bother me... only when the temperature is above 32 and high humidity, then it becomes a problem. Even then, I would rather have the humid heat than dry heat.

Even though I live in the tropics now... I still miss equatorial tropics... That's where my heart is...

[BS Man about Palms]

From our "Hobby" standpoint, I gleaned this info from Jeff Marcus and Jeff Searle... Tis far easier to GERMINATE seeds in Hawaii without constant damping off, BUT once to healthy 4" size, A Florida summer is equivalent to a Hawaii year! I used to be skeptical how fast Jeff Searle said he would shift palms up.... till I saw it. Its like Magic dust to us So Cal people. I have heard Jeff S say "oh yeah, that 4" tall plant will be 18" tall by end of summer...or more" with rare exception, its true.

[ariscott]

Yes... it the combination of sun and rain that does it... Same here, BS

[Kim]

Humans are quite adaptable -- that's why they live all over the planet. The older I get, the more I appreciate warmth over cold. Not too hot and dry, not too cold. But that's me. Explaining, discussing, and understanding the differences and similarities of climates is informative and interesting, but there is no single "best climate" for everyone. I know this is very hard to believe, but there are people on the planet who don't give a hoot about palms and actually love four distinct seasons, including SNOW! I've even heard them say, "Nice weather 12 months a year is BORING!" Can you imagine?

[paulgila]

i have met people like that,too,kim,but i try to avoid them.

[Jerry@TreeZoo]

Some of my in-laws live in Minnesoooda. To them, summer time is the bad weather and winter is good! Go figure.

[Rick Santos]

Hi, Don,

I always value your input on this because you're an experienced tropical traveler. It's puzzling to me , a bit. I don;t know if Miami area would be more similar to an island or a continent? It's attached to the huge North American land mass, but it is surrounded by water on three sides etc.

I can honeslty say that when I flew back to Miami, I really prefered the conditions. The sky was clear and crisp , and the sun just felt more intense to me. ( Puerto Rico was verty clear while I was there also)

I cannot understand why? Miami was ideal to me that day , and had me wondering why I went to Puerto Rico for ( spending an extra $ 800 ) LOL !!!

I like Puerto Rico, but since I go there strictly for climate and vegetation, I would have stayed in Miami because I have good friends here. I only know a few people in Puerto Rico and they are more aqaintances. September is MY FAVORITE time of year here. All the yellow dragon flies are out.

It's possible and even likely Manaus has a better experience than Miami for "prettiness" and sun intensity and "feel". But, of course, you would know that far better than I would, because I have never been to Manaus . LOL ! But, I know you have said they are very similar, so I trust that.

I know this much, if I had free tickets to either Africa/ Manaus/Fortaleza/Barranquilla vs a place like the Lesser Antilles, I would EASILY take the former choices over small islands. I just don't like islands much. I feel trapped, unsafe from weather,the ocean, and also it feels like I am in the center of nowhere.


I think the Amazon and Africa are very pretty and love the fact I could escape a tidal wave , or hurricane given warning. ( I know Manaus does not get hurricanes being 3 S)

Edited by Rick Santos, 14 December 2011 - 07:14 AM.

[floridagrower]

One of my favorite things is listening to foreigners (quite often from other tropical regions) complain about the "heat" when they visit or move here. I've never understood this. I've heard this from people from India, various South American countries, Puerto Rico, Hawaii, and EVERY state in the country. Either all of these random people are wrong or there is something special here about the weather. The combination of intense sun / heat, super high humidity, and high temperatures make for very brutal weather indeed. But for me it's like a comforting blanket. It's warm thoughts and happy memories. But most of all it's home.

I laughed when Bo mention the no AC households in Hawaii. That is unheard of here.

[Jeff Searle]

One of my favorite things is listening to foreigners (quite often from other tropical regions) complain about the "heat" when they visit or move here. I've never understood this. I've heard this from people from India, various South American countries, Puerto Rico, Hawaii, and EVERY state in the country. Either all of these random people are wrong or there is something special here about the weather. The combination of intense sun / heat, super high humidity, and high temperatures make for very brutal weather indeed. But for me it's like a comforting blanket. It's warm thoughts and happy memories. But most of all it's home.

I laughed when Bo mention the no AC households in Hawaii. That is unheard of here.

Jeff,

Very well said! Especially the part, "Warm thoughts and happy memories". Home for sure!
Jeff

[palmmermaid]

Most of the Florida penisula is very young from a geological time frame. And it has been underwater as often as it has been above water. Much of the plant life here is closely related to desert plants instead of tropical ones. The elephant trees in the southwest and the gumbo limbo here are in the same genus - Busera. Many of the tropical plants have been blown in from the Caribbean or carried by humans - yes, the natives who lived here brought seeds and plants from the islands they visited or came from. And many so-called tropical islands are virtual deserts - the Caymans, Bonaire, Aruba, Curacao. Only when you have mountains do you have so-called tropical (at least in the eyes of tourists) islands - think of the Antilles - all volvanic and mountainous, as is Puerto Rico.

I would like the climate in Hawaii I think. It is not as hot and if you go up in elevation just a little you get that wonderful breeze. I don't want a change of season unless it means rainy versus wet.

[realarch]

For me weather wise, Hilo is just perfect. Rarely does the temp., even along the coast get above 85º. The trades blow in from the ocean during the day and then reverse at night with cool breezes coming down from the mountain. I live on
a small ridge and the jalousie windows pretty much stay open year around. I always thought I loved heat and humidity until I went to Key West and New Orleans one summer, I liked to have died. For me 'opressive' is a kind word for that climate.
To each his own and it seems to agree with the millions of folks that live there. The other thing about Hilo is that we don't get strong winds like the other parts of the Islands and the rain just comes straight down. Since most of the houses have 36"
eaves the windows just stay open during heavy downpours which is so cool. Anywho, maybe during winter time the climate is similar, but during the summer months it's quite different.

[amazondk]

Rick,

The thing people here always comment on is the heat. But, since it is always pretty much the same I think it is pretty much just to talk about something. Since it never gets cold I guess you have to talk about something. In spite of the fact that there are many similarities to the climate in Miami there are also differnces. For one it never gets even close to feezing, it really never gets below 70 F here. And, for the most part the nights are nicer here than s. Florida in the summer. i guess this is the continental effect. We have had a lot of big bang thunderstorms lately. As long as there is not a direct hit and the power does not go out I have no problem with these as well. Living on the equator in the low land tropics is just quite tropical, all the time.

dk

Hi, Don,

I always value your input on this because you're an experienced tropical traveler. It's puzzling to me , a bit. I don;t know if Miami area would be more similar to an island or a continent? It's attached to the huge North American land mass, but it is surrounded by water on three sides etc.

I can honeslty say that when I flew back to Miami, I really prefered the conditions. The sky was clear and crisp , and the sun just felt more intense to me. ( Puerto Rico was verty clear while I was there also)

I cannot understand why? Miami was ideal to me that day , and had me wondering why I went to Puerto Rico for ( spending an extra $ 800 ) LOL !!!

I like Puerto Rico, but since I go there strictly for climate and vegetation, I would have stayed in Miami because I have good friends here. I only know a few people in Puerto Rico and they are more aqaintances. September is MY FAVORITE time of year here. All the yellow dragon flies are out.

It's possible and even likely Manaus has a better experience than Miami for "prettiness" and sun intensity and "feel". But, of course, you would know that far better than I would, because I have never been to Manaus . LOL ! But, I know you have said they are very similar, so I trust that.

I know this much, if I had free tickets to either Africa/ Manaus/Fortaleza/Barranquilla vs a place like the Lesser Antilles, I would EASILY take the former choices over small islands. I just don't like islands much. I feel trapped, unsafe from weather,the ocean, and also it feels like I am in the center of nowhere.


I think the Amazon and Africa are very pretty and love the fact I could escape a tidal wave , or hurricane given warning. ( I know Manaus does not get hurricanes being 3 S)

[amazondk]

Just an observation, but to like living in a humid hot climate one has to be comfortable with sweat. Not everyone is and not everyone for sure is comfortable with this. Most people from down south in Brazil go through a bit of a shock when they come to Amazonia. Although they live in mostly sub tropical climates they are not used to climate here and many complain all the time. Personally I like hot humid weather. I always enjoyed the summers in S. Florida, and here is sort of a year around S. Florida summer. Except it gets hotter in the peak of the dry season, August - September, and there is about twice as much rain per year. I am sure I would like the weather in Hilo just fine as well.

dk

[Laisla87]

I am also one of these 'strange' people who likes humidity. I lived for several years in Hong Kong (same latitude as Cuba) where summer temps would be a minimum of 27 and max of 33 with about 80-90% humidity. Sometimes it gets so bad that you see it dripping down your walls. Despite this, I never used air conditioning. I'd put on a fan when I was asleep sometimes, and that was sufficient. There is something invigorating about sleeping with windows open, hearing crickets, waking up warm, trying to do all your gardening before the worst heat of the day then just sitting back drinking cold drinks. It was great.

I have lived in various tropical climates, and they are all different. I disliked Cairns intensely, despite people saying it is an ideal climate. It was too rainy and cloudy for much of the year. The long wet season made it impossible to garden. Cuba is much more dry and sunny and I found the variety of plants that I could grow there as a result was much better. Personally I love Miami, I think it is one of the best climates to grow a variety of plants - tropicals, subtropicals and temperate plants can all be grown there.

[JungleGina]

I lived in HI for 6 years in my younger unencumbered days. Whenever I found myself thinking it was hot, I reminded myself that was NOTHING compared to Florida--where the air is often unmoving and stifling hot, and the humidity is oppressive. On the East Coast of FL you get pleasant winds from the Jet Stream but not so much here on the west side. Florida is flat as can be and HI has mountains, which not only means different microclimates but you can go hiking and experience different microclimates and awesome views. Here you get palmettos and swamp (which granted is beautiful in its own right). Hawaii has no snakes which is nice when you're romping around in the woods, and no rabies, which is a nice benefit. I wasn't a plant nerd when I lived there so I missed out on a lot. (But I'm going to visit at the end of February and am looking forward to seeing some palm and bamboo growers!) My heart still belongs in HI but for me FL is the next best, most affordable thing.

[Dakotafl]

Im a floridian And as such love it here, Never been to hawaii but i don't really like a true tropical climate, Sure there is zero danger from cold but its also enjoyable to me to have a few days in the lower lower 70s, Summer is always brutal but i try not to complain because the plants grow like crazy.

I looked on Street View maps of singapore and it looked so dull, all there was were lipstick palm after lipstick palm, Royal Poincianas dont flower well there because theres no dry season. I know thats not hawaii but its just an example of a climate i dont like.

[ariscott]

We are in the true tropical region... and poincianna is beautiful here.... So, don't generalise... not all tropical places are the same...

[Dakotafl]

We are in the true tropical region... and poincianna is beautiful here.... So, don't generalise... not all tropical places are the same...

Sorry, equatorial, my bad.

Edited by Dakotafl, 05 January 2012 - 10:18 AM.

[amazondk]

Here in my part of the equatorial tropics the poincianas really do not put on much of a show. But, there are lots of other trees that do. A yellow tabebuia in full flower towering out of the canopy of the rainforest is an incrediblee sight for sure.

dk