33 replies to this topic

[Ken Johnson]

This may be fun AND educational. I hope any new or old member will enjoy reading this history. We should include information that the Board of Directors has generated through minutes all the way to stories of hot tubs and rum.

If you have memories and even facts to share please help this thread to include information on all the great things The Palm Society and IPS have done through the years.

Anyone have information on our start?

[Dypsisdean]

There is an article written by Dick Douglas on page 17-18 in the Online Palm Mag I did for Palmpedia
Online Palm Mag

[dalmatiansoap]

nice article

[Ken Johnson]

How about right now? Does anyone here know the net worth of IPS?
Then we can go back to 1957!

[Kim]

Ken, the net worth of the IPS is somewhere between $450,000 to $500,000. The largest portion of that is an endowment fund from which up to 5% is drawn each year to fund palm research. The IPS Treasurer, Mike Merritt, will have more details if you'd like to alert him to this thread.

[Ken Johnson]

Kim,

I would like to alert everyone to this thread! Wow thats a lot of money!


On the topic of History I know that Dent Smith donated money when Pincipies first came out to keep it running. I don't know how much money but I understand that over time it added up to a good sum. As the Society grew it raised funds that eventually made Principies (now Palms) self sufficient. Principies, a very important scientific journal, had been formed and today it stands as a scientific authority on new palm discoveries and research. It is the crown jewel for which I.P.S. exists.

In a strange dichotomy of mission the next greatest thing that I.P.S. (then The Palm Society) did was to have rum and hot tub parties! These became the famous Biennial Tours. A sort of worlds largest PRA ( a PRA is a Palm Related Activity, coined here on PalmTalk by one or two of our great members!). Biennials are every two years and International Palm Society members are invited to go to palmy place somewhere on the planet and then tour the palmy places while on bus rides (and other unusual forms of transportation) that turn into forums for palm chat from around the world. People have so much fun and pictures of that fun are now available to the entire world because of the development of PalmTalk. Yes there were hot tubs and swimming pools at even the earliest Biennials like the Miami "Thanksgiving Day" biennial back in the day! Rum too is a common drink in the tropics and is commonly seen in pictures of Biennials from the start.

[bgl]

Ken,

Thanks a lot for starting this thread. There's certainly a lot of interesting history behind the IPS, but I'm not sure that all of it can be told here. Stories that in some cases go back to the 1970s! I would like to provide a bit more background information about the Biennials. I don't have the time right now, but will give it some thought and add more information later on. And about the endowment fund. As Kim mentioned, this is where the bulk of the money is invested so this is not money that can be used for any other purpose. The actual operating fund of the IPS is much more modest and it's a tight squeeze to make ends meet. Membership has been dropping for many years but seems to have stabilized now. Apparently this is true for most, if not all, plant societies. So much information is available on the Internet and that's how many people educate themselves. PalmTalk of course is a great example of this. More later.

Bo-Göran

[Ken Johnson]

One interesting part of "The Palm Society" growing up was how we got so many members from outside the U.S.A. Fairchild Botanic Gardens was cultivating palm interest, had planted 100's of different kinds of palms and was distributing them to their members.

[bubba]

Great Topic. A great Member from the Orlando area provided me with an autobiography of Dent Smith's early escapades as a young man in Mexico,working for various oil companies. Dent Smith was quite a character.I believe he met his wife there and likely developed his keen interest in Palms there also.

Many of the old Principe Articles give great insight into some fantastic journeys and personalities.Very interesting reading and you can now view them as an IPS Member all the way to the inception.

[Dypsisdean]

The newer members really have no idea how easy they have it these days. 25 years ago if I wanted a 5 gal Dypsis, I had to scour SoCal. And if I wanted one that was semi-rare, there may have been only one or two people that had one available. And that was only known after numerous phone calls. And that might only have been available if you had something cool for a trade. Sprouting your own seeds was the only option in most cases. And waiting 5 years to find out you really didn't have what you thought you did, was a little discouraging. I also remember plenty of the newer special palms I tried that went to that big compost heap in the sky due to a lack of knowledge about how to care for and treat younger palms in a marginal climate like SoCal.

I can remember if I were lucky enough to locate a sought after palm of any size, I would drive for many hours round trip for just that one palm. Now-a-days, Jungle Music is 2 mins from my SoCal home, and I could literally go pick up 100 nice size Dypsis and Ravenea in no time. And there are a dozen other "rare" palm nurseries online and within an easy drive.

The younger guys today take it for granted that they can easily locate almost anything they want, in any size, and at a decent price. And they know where to plant it, at what size, and what kind of special considerations it may need. I doubt any of this would be the case today if it weren't for the IPS.

[Ken Johnson]

Dean that reminds me of the old seed bank. Way back in the day, before inter web, if you wanted "rare" palm seeds all you had to do was join The Palm Society. We had many new members because of the seed bank, just as we do now because of PalmTalk! I still have a palm I grew from seed 25 years ago that I got from the seed bank.

Now if you get some seeds and don't know what they are you can post a picture and in minutes MattyB will tell you what you have. PalmTalk has become more popular than our Journal now and as it grows I expect we will have even better resources in the future. Data being propagated here will surely end up in a huge base where we will have every palm in the world discussed and photographed in some way!

We have come a long way since the seed bank!

[_Wal]

I missed the seed bank years for our society.

[Tropicgardener]

I missed the seed bank years for our society.

I remember the seed bank years Wal.......used to get all sorts of interesting things.

[Ken Johnson]

Here is a link that JasonM was reading today in the chat room. http://en.wikipedia....Harold_E._Moore

[OldNed]

Back in about 1968-69 a friend invited me down to Fl. Institute of Technology (FIT) to see some Palms in a Garden on the campus.

He said an acquaintance of his was going to show a few of us Audubon Society members around the Gardens. I was new to Florida at the time-interested in birds & other critters.
Had only a passing interest in plants back then.

His acquaintance was Dent Smith; we had a great tour.


Found these on youtube:

[OldNed]

[Ken Johnson]

The early Califonia, Austrailia, French and others who became members of The Palm Society were the beginings of I.P.S. The formation of other non-profit palm groups sprung up like Ptychospserms on a hot wet day. I speak with many of them every day right here in the chat room.

TBC

[BS Man about Palms]

The newer members really have no idea how easy they have it these days. 25 years ago if I wanted a 5 gal Dypsis, I had to scour SoCal. And if I wanted one that was semi-rare, there may have been only one or two people that had one available. And that was only known after numerous phone calls. And that might only have been available if you had something cool for a trade. Sprouting your own seeds was the only option in most cases. And waiting 5 years to find out you really didn't have what you thought you did, was a little discouraging. I also remember plenty of the newer special palms I tried that went to that big compost heap in the sky due to a lack of knowledge about how to care for and treat younger palms in a marginal climate like SoCal.

I can remember if I were lucky enough to locate a sought after palm of any size, I would drive for many hours round trip for just that one palm. Now-a-days, Jungle Music is 2 mins from my SoCal home, and I could literally go pick up 100 nice size Dypsis and Ravenea in no time. And there are a dozen other "rare" palm nurseries online and within an easy drive.

The younger guys today take it for granted that they can easily locate almost anything they want, in any size, and at a decent price. And they know where to plant it, at what size, and what kind of special considerations it may need. I doubt any of this would be the case today if it weren't for the IPS.

I missed this earlier Dean and find it to be very true! But...

I heard someone hypothosize that we have witnessed the "glory days" as such and it will go back to getting harder... ??

reasons cited:

Loss of Habitat to find new palms . Particularly madagascar and others
Stricter regulations on seeds leaving country of orgin
Tougher economy causing growers to not venture out into "the rare, slow, hard to grow stuff" due to high loss, then less customers to afford your hard work


Thoughts?


While I agree in some respects with the above, on the other hand I refuse to believe it because I DON'T WANT it to be true!! haha

[Ken Johnson]

Recent history shows that we now have over 4,000 members on PalmTalk.org and we almost have half a million posts!

[_Wal]

Well I'd love to read more history of the IPS and all the other societies around the world. I'm only new to the Australian Palm and Cycad Society but from what I've read they were originally an interest group exchanging info etc that became more structured in the early 80s with branches around Australia. I can't see any direct affiliation to IPS with PACSOA, but there have been and currently are members of PACSOA who are Directors on IPS for example. PACSOA established a Publication Fund back in the mid 80s, and has published eight original works in book form, including four major publications of original works that include:

Palms of Subequatorial Queensland by Robert Tucker
Palms of The South-West Pacific by John L. Dowe

I have these two books and they are still a great and relevant read today.

Would the IPS have funded any book works in the past ?

I think it would be great if the funds could be found to make and produce a DVD film documentary series on palms in habitat and cultivation (various botanical gardens around the globe). Guaranteed plenty of sales, 4000 members on Palmtalk might want copies of these for example.

[Kim]

Have you visited palms.org? I recommend a look around. The IPS has indeed funded book publications in the past, but I don't have a complete list. Genera Palmarum II, sound familiar? Here's a link to the book section: Publications

[_Wal]

Have you visited palms.org? I recommend a look around. The IPS has indeed funded book publications in the past, but I don't have a complete list. Genera Palmarum II, sound familiar? Here's a link to the book section: Publications

Thanks Kim, GP 2 is a biggie indeed.

Thailand biennial could potentially be the beginnings of a doco, "Palm Places, Palm People". On the run interviews etc.

[palmmermaid]

Has there been any thought or discussion for putting Palms in a digital format so members can receive it via email instead of hard copy? I receive as many newsletters and magazines electronically as possible. In my mind if you are a conservation-minded society, then you should conserve paper, ink, postage, fuel, etc. I know all the resistance arguments. But maybe it could be an option.

[Kim]

I'm with you on this idea. There is tremendous resistance, but my belief is eventually it will become imperative.

[bgl]

Has there been any thought or discussion for putting Palms in a digital format so members can receive it via email instead of hard copy? I receive as many newsletters and magazines electronically as possible. In my mind if you are a conservation-minded society, then you should conserve paper, ink, postage, fuel, etc. I know all the resistance arguments. But maybe it could be an option.

Kitty,

For it to be the only option is probably a bit off into the future, but it is of course already available on the main IPS site. And all the back-issues as well. The dilemma with going to "digital only" is that there WILL be a sizeable number of people who don't want that. They want their paper copy, in hand, and that's important to them. Going to digital only may also mean a major drop in the number of members. How many - nobody knows. But you're right - eventually I am sure it will happen and the question is "when?"

Bo-Göran

[Jerry@TreeZoo]

I always enjoy getting my hard copy of Palms, but I think it is kind of wasteful. I think that a digital form of Palms could include more photos and data, as the cost is nothing, as opposed to the expenses of printing and mailing a larger quarterly. Having a larger document online would get people to change over more quickly, IMO.

[Dypsisdean]

I had suggested using interactive online publishing to the IPS about 3 years ago when the concept of interactive magazines was just starting. I even put together a sample publication that included the audio and video enhancements that these formats can include within the pages. If you have ever viewed today's magazines or newspapers on a tablet like the iPad, you would understand and enjoy how much better of an experience it is than hard copy. You could have the entire library of every Palms Journal publication searchable and indexed at your finger tips whenever you had your tablet/smart phone/computer with you - along with Hi-Def photos as good or better than the print editions.

Here is an example of what I did three years ago to show the IPS Board what could be done. IMO the advantages of embedding web links, video, and audio within the pages of a Palms Journal would be fantastic. And after the initial "publication" it could be sent immediately to 10 or 10,000 people in an instant at no cost.

For those who never saw this PalmMag Online sample, you can view it HERE Keep in mind this is using very old software, so is a lot slower and more resource demanding than what is available today. (It may take a little time to buffer, depending on your set up) It was meant to excite some people about the possibilities that new technology was offering, but the reaction wasn't even luke warm.

[palmmermaid]

Dean,

Thanks for posting this! A great start and with all the advances today, it could be awesome.

I do get a couple of magazines in digital format. They are so much better. And I don't have stacks of paper laying around. I can search them, print something if needed, get more information, more pictures and videos. So much more than with a printed one.

I've tried to get our society to use email instead of printing but they have resisted and still resist. I am aware that not everyone will be a convert but if you can cut the number of printed copies in half, that is a big savings. Our bromeliad society is phasing out printed newsletters this year. It will be electronic only. A couple of the others I am a memeber of are also doing the same thing. In many societies the expense of a printed newsletter costs more per member than the membership fee. If that is the case, then I see only 2 logical choices - raise the membership fee or go digital. No one wants to raise membership but they don't want to go digital either. The biggest reason I've heard is that the newsletter is the biggest benefit of being a member. Oh, well, can't change everyone's mind.

[bgl]

There's no question that going to digital would be a major step forward, and I am sure that it will happen at some point. Hopefully sooner rather than later. But cutting the number of printed copies in half is not a solution - it would have to be an "all or nothing" approach. Cutting the number of printed copies in half would not cut the printing cost in half. As a matter of fact, the saving would be insignificant, and there would have to be a choice for members to pick either a printed copy or the digital one, with the digital membership being considerably less expensive in order to encourage people to pick that option. That would inevitably make the printed copy prohibitely expensive, which is why an "all or nothing" approach is the only workable one. The main reason why such a change has not taken place (speaking of the IPS), even though it would bring many benefits, is that it would be a major decision and a dramatic break from what's been done for MANY years. A very general observation would be that the IPS Board has always been very conservative. Contemplating and implementing dramatic changes falls a bit outside of "conservative". But hopefully, one day....

Bo-Göran

[Dypsisdean]

Bo,

There is a third option - "in addition to." And by doing so, that could offer a transition to what is clearly the inevitable future. By doing so, all the "kinks" could be worked out. And if it was done correctly and with quality, many people would use the online version (especially when researching a topic) and become comfortable with that format before attempting any transition.

I believe they are trying that already. I noticed the newest Palms was placed online using a version of the method I have been advocating. However, I can't see if it is viewable using a tablet or smart phone because apparently the palms.org site is not compatible with iPads - and I can't log into the Member's Section. This is something that should be corrected since tablets will soon be the primary way a majority of people will be accessing the web.

Not to be forgotten as one of the obvious advantages to online publishing is that it would hold the promise of making "Palms" profitable to publish and distribute. As I understand it, publishing and distributing "Palms" does not generate much, if any revenue, for the Society. If people had to choose between a membership that reflected the true cost of printing and distributing "Palms," as opposed to a reduced online version, I know which I would choose. And don't forget that any and all errors could be easily fixed, or information added, after the fact - something not possible in hard copy.

[Kathryn]

Thanks for posting that link Dean. I'm on the board of directors and have never seen that before.

I would much prefer an electronic version and would not expect a reduction in my membership fee as a result. Why can't we offer members this option?

I'm so tired of hearing about the conservative boards members. If the IPS continues to do things they way they have always been done, it won't exist for very long. It may even be too late with awesome sites like The Palm Nut Pages, Palmpedia, and the PACSOA. Even Wikipedia has more information on palms than the IPS website.

[palmmermaid]

Kathryn,

Well said! If you aren't on the train when it leaves the station, you will always be chasing it.

I don't expect a reduction in any of my dues because I make the decision to be kinder to the environemnt and receive the newsletter electronically.

One of the biggest objection I hear is that if you keep hard copies, you can always go back. Maybe so, but I can't ever remember what issue an article was in! Much easier to search online.

[Dypsisdean]

Thanks for posting that link Dean. I'm on the board of directors and have never seen that before.

I would much prefer an electronic version and would not expect a reduction in my membership fee as a result. Why can't we offer members this option?

I'm so tired of hearing about the conservative boards members. If the IPS continues to do things they way they have always been done, it won't exist for very long. It may even be too late with awesome sites like The Palm Nut Pages, Palmpedia, and the PACSOA. Even Wikipedia has more information on palms than the IPS website.

Kathryn,
While your thoughts are shared by many I have talked with, the conversation always reverts to the same bottom line. And that is - that as long as the majority of the Board continues to be older, conservative, retired people with a fair amount of discretionary income and little exposure to the rapid evolution and possibilities of the internet world, the Society will stay conservative with little desire to embrace new technology and approaches. The problem is compounded by the fact that 2/3 of those Directors are pretty much uninvolved even as Directors.

So suggestions as to how to persuade more progressively minded individuals to become involved Directors lies at the heart of any solution.

[palm a grant it]

Thank you for the history, I have read from old prencepies about trips and adventures and I found them quite enjoyable.
Correct me if i am wrong but I think the natural progression of things to come will be having both since the digital version is inexpencive to incorporate and As time go's on and people get use to using the digital version, the paper version will get to the point where it will not be cost efective as paper costs only go down with volume and tecnology will become evermore avaliable in parts of the world where we are not.
I feel that all members should think about ways to generate income for the society and post their ideas in a digital fish bowl. Then upon review, approval and implamtation of the Idea by the board that member will revieve free membership discounts to biannials air fare perks, gifts etc... based on the profets and preformance from the first six months or year of their idea's implamentation. An Idea that I have is to offer Biannial posters with a picture or comemrative logo of the trip, you know something collectable from the adventures of a palm nuts. Everyone likes adventure and there is something to be said about sitting back and enjoying reading something printed in a book or journal about like minded people off on an adventure discovering new sites, things and thoughts. It is intreaging for people to escape their every day biz to ponder the journey. Just as those antisapating the upcomming Thailand biannial adventure. I wonder if we will be able to take a raft ride while in Thailand ?
Grant