Seronoa repens (blue form)

[Natureguy]

This is mostly for Ken Johnson, but I welcome any comments or experiences from all.

I was in Hobe Sound, FL the other day and found a wonderful collection of the blue form of saw palmetto. I will be back there in two weeks with a backhoe operator. My intent is to see if I can transplant saw palmetto successfully? Can these be field dug and transplanted easily? Do they take transplanting well? They will need to make a 2 hour drive home, as well. or should I just go buy one? Last summer I had a backhoe operator dig a small field grown cabbage palm. I took it home and had in the ground within 30 minutes of excavation. The center spear came out in the first week, so I ditched it. Don't want to do it again unless I can do it successfully!

thanks,

bob

[Tala]

try to get ahold of David I think it is, at Green Images in Christmas - been awhile since I was there but he had lots of these from 3g to 15g sizes, uses Hobe Sound as seed source, or did at one time. Us locals often refer to them as "white" Saw Palmettos, the glaucous hue much more pronounced on these than anywhere else in Fl. Another good source (but much farther drive) is Perkins in LaBelle. They have container and specimen sized plants available.

You can transplant these, I've done it many times but there are several tricks to the trade I'm a bit reluctant to post on a mssg board. Most are already aware of one of them - cauterizing cut roots, this helps but does not ensure total success.

Here's mine

[JayW]

Like Tala was saying... they can be transplanted, but it's VERY tricky! If you tried a Sabal Palmetto and it died, I wouldn't recommend trying a Seronoa repens. I know a guy who has been in the palm trade for over 30's years and he said the same thing... they are VERY hard to transplant unless you know exactly what to do and get real lucky!

[Natureguy]

Dave,

you have the nicest plants! That saw palmetto is stunning! How old is that? I stopped at a place in Palm City called Botanics of Martin County. Incredible place and bought a nice Arenga engleri on my way home!

He had hundreds of blue saw palmettos that he said the seeds came from Hobe Sound, as well. I will probably pick one up on my way home the next time I am there. I am working on a project site in Hobe Sound that will be bulldozed soon. That is why I thought it I would try to dig up a couple and bring them home. If they are difficult to transplant, I may not try it. I hate losing plants! Hate it!!!!

thanks for the info,

Bob

[Dave-Vero]

That's David Drylie of Green Images in Christmas. (407) 568-1333. He's been a leading native plant nursery operator and stalwart of the Florida Native Plant Society for many years.

My prospering clump (as shown on my thumbnail) is from Drylie, container-grown. The first year was awful--apparently some fungus infections that I didn't treat quickly enough, but the recuperation from seeming death was quick and the clump is booming.

These are gorgeous plants. Along A1A in southern Brevard, it's a shame to see native blue palmettos displaced by assorted other landscaping.

[JayW]

If there going to be bulldozed anyway, I'd give it a shot! try and get some with a lot of trunk as I have heard that is one of the keys to their survival. If I knew more I'd tell you... good luck!

[PalmGuyWC]

Ken Johnson,

Let us hear from you about the surviveability of Seronoa being dug from habitat. I've heard it's mostly a futile effort, and if they do survive it takes years before they start growing again. My bet would be seed grown plants with established root systems are the best choice.

I have several that I have obtained in Fla. over the years. In Calif. they make great container plants, but the ones I've planted don't like my winter time cold adobe clay. I've found they do best in my situation to let them stay on the dry side in the summer, even to the point of letting a couple of the lowest fronds wither. I have one silver that is doing great with neglect. I only water it 3 or 4 times in the warmer months. The others that get more water slowly shed crowns from rot.

Seronoas are about as rare in Calif. as Howeas are in S. Florida, but I love the palms, especially the silver ones. Someone could make a lot of money if a legal way could be found to ship the silver ones into Calif.

Dick

[Ken Johnson]

Just saw this post.

Lets see... in this case you have palms that are going to be bulldozed anyway? Then you may have no time to root prune. The best chance (and cheapest way since you may lose them) is to defoliate compleatly and try to get single trunks that are touching the ground and rooting out from the trunk. You will not be able to get a "root ball" in most cases. The sandy soil falls right off. After removal wrap the whole thing in wet burlap, do not let then dry out. Burry the whole trunk just underground in the final location and keep wet. You can let the trunk show in the future by removing soil later. (You can plant high now but cover it)It is sort of like air layering the thing. Let us know what you do.

[amazon exotics]

I say don't waste your time. It easier to buy some 3 or 7 gallons and plant those. Just hate to see you put in all that time & effort to them and they die.

[FRITO]

A friend of mine has done somthing very similar to what Ken Johnson says.

Try to find a long trunking one that has had been covered and has areial roots from the trunk. saw of the trink and protect the areial roots keeping them moist. Cut all the fronds off the 'log' and plants in a sandy soil and keep moist. its takes a couple years but this is how ive seen it done and even then its a crap shoot

I have another friend who tells me how they do it to field grown specimens in florida:

As the bucket/heavy equipment escavates aroung a larger multi branced specimen, they pull it out the sand and hang it it the air off the bucket. Then guys with blow torches cauterize the roots of the ripped up root ball, keep its from 'bleeding out'

the specimens are then taken to big berms of mulch and tucked in there for a couple years as a mister system daily keeps them moist and allows new roots to grow. they are then pluck from the mulched with a new set of roots.

Edited February 9, 2010 by FRITO

[Ken Johnson]

I have not done many but everyone I did with kid gloves lived.

[Davidl]

I have seen them transplanted and they lived but I didn't find out how they did it. They took a few years to start growing any noticeable growth. I have heard stories of burning the roots but not sure myself how well it works. I would try what Ken said and would try some by cauterizing the roots just to see if it works. I'm sure we all would love to know the results.

[Ken Johnson]

Just to discuss the root burning a little. The idea is not so much to sterilize the roots, an open flame will not do this, but to stimulate the palm. The idea is (and this is NOT science,yet)to stimulate the palm to produce hormones that promote root growth. The thinking is that this is what happens in a natural fire. Only a fire does not cut, break, tear,reduce by 90% and generally mutilate roots. We do that with our digging equipment and if we are carefull we can limit that damage. In the case of these naturally occuring palms getting long roots contained in soil is a problem. In that case anything that may stimulate root growth should be good. I like water and soil over burning.

Once I did a few where there were virtually no roots when I finished. I cut slowly over months and realy only found a small amout of roots and as I cut them the leaves did not die back much at all. By the end I lost about half the leaves and after replanting the "logs" they sprouted full new heads within a year.

BTW a year ot two recovery is nothing for a 100-200 year old palm!

[Mark Heath]

Bob,

I say go for it! You have nothing to lose and everything to gain seeing they will be dug up anyways.

I have about 60% survival rate w/ transplanting these guys. 3 out of 5 so far and one is the silver form.

I removed all fronds except the emerging spear. I wish i knew what Ken had shared before doing this, otherwise i would've had 100%.

The property behind me was just about to be cleared for a housing development, so a day before destruction i saved as many as i could. Please do the same and keep us informed as to your success!!

[merrill]

There was a grower who cut Serenoa trunks with a very sharp brush axe, and reported they grew when planted in suitable sandy soil. Generally, the more trunk, the easier to transplant.

merrill

[Natureguy]

I didn't think the pictures are that great, since I took them with my iphone! I knew I would be going back there in a couple of weeks, then I would take more pictures with a digital camera. I also took some pictures of 2 incredible Arenga pinnata on US1 in Hobe Sound. The lighting and shade just didn't make for good pictures. When I go down there again I will be taking pictures of those babies!

Per Frito's request, I am posting the pictures I took with my phone! no complaints please, actually they are not bad at all considering.....

hope this works...first time posting so many pics

Bob

[Natureguy]

[Natureguy]

took me a couple of tries, but I think I got it.........

[Natureguy]

that's it there folks!

[Natureguy]

now that I see them online.....not bad for phone pics.....

[FRITO]

Thanks for the pics Bob, they are decent for a camera phone! Kris in India may not call them 'high res stills' but its better than nothing!

[Rusty on Pine Is.]

now that I see them online.....not bad for phone pics.....

Ah, a flair for understatement!

Great pics of a pretty palm in habit...thanks for posting them, they're great!

Rusty