Beccariophoenix sp. (High Plateaux)

[toto]

Thanks god, no frost this winter...toto

[Alberto]

QUOTE Alberto :from Nigels thread about climate of Madagascars High Plateau.QUOTE

´´I was thinking to let one of my seedlings outside in a frosty night to see there hardiness ...but maybe it´s better to let my precious seedlings grow somewhat before there final test...´´

....I let one of my weakest seedlings (lost atached seed : mices meel...) a night at exactly 0`C with frost at the lowest place on my property ,totally exposed.

I doesn´t show any damage! If it was a D. onilahensis it was toasted now!

   I´ll let the same seedling exposed this winter and see what happens with lower temps.....

[Alberto]

I have hope we can post photos of specimens like this in future:                                                                          

[madagascarbob]

My non window form went through the freeze spotless ,window form a little burned.

[jdapalms]

From a grower's point of view I do not see the difference in what is reffered to as B. sp. no windows or B. alfredii they seem to be the same. The lowland window var. (juvinile leaves) is very different looking. I'm sure that there can be variables in different high pleau groups but what are we talking about 2 species or 3. Maybe someone can clear this up. Pictures or descriptions would be great. I have just read the article in PALMS Vol. 51 "A New Species of Beccariophoenix" What I have been growing for some time now as the B. sp. no windows is a very hardy palm for Southern Calif. so it seems to me that this may be the B. alfredii (high plateau).

[Gtlevine]

I'm glad you chimed in with this opinion Jerry, I have shared this view. The new species Alfredii is a beautiful palm, but can it be of more value to So Cal growers than the "No Windows" variety is yet to be seen. Attached is a copy of one of my nine foot "No Windows" form that felt quite comfortable in the coldest part of my property through the great freeze. It's still a great discovery, but it will be interesting how well it fares in So Cal.

Gary

[doubravsky]

My "no windows" (from Jerry Andersen's) also took the great freeze with not even a spot of damage... temps at least as low as 24 degrees. This is definitely one of my favorites.. and doesn't mind the inland heat or the cold a bit at all...

Here's a shot from last month... next to the Bizzie...

[JD in the OC]

Gary,

How old is that 9 footer??

I have a few that are 4 feet tall in 15 gallon containers.  They're slllllloooooooowwww...

Jerry,

The Alfredii seedlings seem to be more lanceolate than No Windows and they have a slight bluish/grey hue on the abaxial side.

[Alberto]

Please,can somebody post some pic of your B.alfredii seedlings?

[Gtlevine]

(JD in the OC @ Jul. 08 2007,18:33)

QUOTE

Gary,

How old is that 9 footer??

I have a few that are 4 feet tall in 15 gallon containers.  They're slllllloooooooowwww...

Jerry,

The Alfredii seedlings seem to be more lanceolate than No Windows and they have a slight bluish/grey hue on the abaxial side.

I planted mine from 10 gallon pots about 3.5 feet overall height exactly three years ago. I know they are super slow when young, but definately speed up when they get some size. I think they also like the really hot weather out here in Escondido. If you don't plant yours soon I'm coming over and hijacking them, I can never have enough of a good thing.

Gary

[JD in the OC]

Gary,

So there's hope!!!

I love the coconut-look-a-likes and this one definitely takes the cake.

I'm going to keep mine in 15's until they are 6 or 7 feet tall, then plant them out.  I scooped them up from Phil's a while ago.  He says there is a guy in Escondido who has a trunking specimen that is gorgeous.

Can you picture a driveway lined with trunking No Windows?!? Someday... someday...

Here's what mine look like (I have since dug this one up and repotted)

[Urban Rainforest]

Not only did my no windows make it through this winters cold without any damage I actually planted it the winter before in Jan! Very tough palms. I also have a couple Beccariophoenix Alfredii in my shadehouse but their too small to note differances as yet. Steve

[Alberto]

My B.alfredii seedlings show 5 to 6 strap leaves now.

I´m curious to see how other seedlings are performing.....

[mnorell]

My B. alfredii (a 3-leaf seedling in the ground, under open sky but mulched) did burn above the mulch-line in our freezes this past winter, the worst was 23.3F, 15 hours below freezing. Two other moderately bad freezes to about 25-27F, I think they were about 6-8 hours below freezing each. Otherwise several light frosts/freezes above 28F. The palm is now growing strongly, three new leaves and loving the hot sun! 'No windows' also burned, and in a more protected, shady spot, also above the mulch-line, but is recovering. I am noticing that Beccariophoenix do not like shade and grow very slowly in it...

[brodklop]

Here are a few pics of all 3 forms

the no window form or the true B. madagascariensis

The window form of B. madagascariensis

[brodklop]

B.alfredii

All 3 are hardy for us in Brisbane

[Kris]

Are there any stills of a grown-up mature palm specimen which is in discussion..just to know how it will look like or have resemblence to any known palm ? i.e a long shot of the entire palm !

thanks & love,

Kris

[Tala]

do we have an "official" verdict and names for all of these yet? I want to start purchasing and installing these in local landscapes but until I know for sure what it is I ain't about to mess w/ it.

Edited November 28, 2008 by Tala

[CarloSpain]

I bought some seeds like Beccariophoenix sp., is posible to know if these palms are B. madagascariensis or alfredii?

[Tyrone]

Show us the seed and I'll tell you.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Pivi]

Here's mine. Picture taken 2 months ago. 7 months from germination.

1 gallon pot.

Edited November 29, 2008 by Pivi

[Pivi]

[Wai`anae Steve]

Here is my little B. alfredii from Floribunda. Planted out in July of this year. Gee did I post this already?

Anyway it came as a 1 gallon size and so far looks good in the ground.

[BS Man about Palms]

Funny, based on what we are seeing around here, Carlo's palms look more like alferdii than Pivi's. Pivi, is yours supposed to be alfredii? (Most B alfredii I have noticed seem to have a creamy yellow/white backside of the petiole)

[Pivi]

Yes, mine is supposed to be alfredii.

Edited November 30, 2008 by Pivi

[Caryota_gigas]

B. alfredii seed look like a B. madagascariensis seed that someone has squeezed between their thumb and forefinger, they are more oblate. The seedlings look the same.

[Tyrone]

The seed is the determining factor. All 3 species look identical for a few years. B alfredii is an oblate seed, wheres B madagscariensis and the sp windows have identical oval looking seeds.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Pivi]

these are seeds that i germinated my palm from. Is it alfredii?

[Tyrone]

these are seeds that i germinated my palm from. Is it alfredii?

Yes. They're B alfredii seed.

Best regards

Tyrone

[Pivi]

Bill wanted me to doubt. Bill

Thanks Tyrone!

[neoflora]

It seems that the B. alfredii are faster in growth than the non windows form. I moved 5-5gals. from my greenhouse to full sun with almost no damage. These plants are showing alot of potential!

[Tala]

has anyone noticed any diff.'s between mature windows & non-windows palms? Seem to recall JD thinking they could eventually wind up being one & the same. I know there appears to be some cultural points to consider, I have the orig. mada palm, probably a yr or two away from flowering and it lost the window slits about 2 yrs ago (past roof hgt.).

[Palm Hound]

has anyone noticed any diff.'s between mature windows & non-windows palms? Seem to recall JD thinking they could eventually wind up being one & the same. I know there appears to be some cultural points to consider, I have the orig. mada palm, probably a yr or two away from flowering and it lost the window slits about 2 yrs ago (past roof hgt.).

Doesn't the windows have a much heftier stem? And doesn't the no windows form have a more compact crown?

[Alberto]

This are mine B.alfredii ,now 2 yo. I spray my palms with Methamidophos,once or twice a month.

They show this dried up leave points. Some palms show some chlorotic leaves. What is this? RPM?

[Alberto]

Other shot

[MattyB]

Alberto, you either have mites that have sucked the juices out of the leaf tips, or you're watering too much and the roots are rotting. At this size, by the time they are solid and do not wobble at all, you can expect the entire pot to be full of roots. Bump them up to larger pots or plant them out at this time. Full sun is ok. You can see my Beccariophoenix gang here: from left to right, windows, mad., alfred

[iamjv]

Tala, do you have any pics of your mada palm? It would be nice to see a visual (as Kris would say)! Jv

[calyptrocalyx&licuala freck]

Hi Guys

I may be stealing John.D's thunder here, but the Beccariophoenix.sp "windows form" has

been given a name and is just waiting to be published.

P.s. Beccariophoenix madagascariensis and Beccariophoenix alfredii are Very

similar to each other, the only differences being as pointed out by Tyrone

is in the shape of the seed, and also what has been pointed out by Ron is

that they grow much faster than B.madagascariensis!.

Regards Mikey......

[MattyB]

Mikey, I've noticed that the B. alfredii has a different terminal leaflet, which in the sceme of things isn't that noticeable, but it does seem to have a more lax, curved frond look than the B. mad. which seems to be quite upright, at least when young. Are you saying that when they get older they look very much alike?

[calyptrocalyx&licuala freck]

Hi Matty,

Once these beauties are mature, they sure do look the same.

Regards Mikey.