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Microcycas calocoma and Encephalartos latifrons seeds wanted...

Kostas

By Kostas
in Palms/Plants/Seeds Wanted

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

Posted
Posted

Hello! :)

I am looking for Microcycas calocoma and Encephalartos latifrons seeds :) I know these arent palms but many of you grow cycads too or even own nurseries raising them!So,has any of you got any sure,pure seeds of these species or maybe know a good and reliable source to buy them?Even a few would do and so if you had bought some in the past and maybe have a few spare left,i would love to buy from you if you got them of a reliable source :) Also,i could think about fullfilling minimum orders of these in case its needed...

Thank you very much in advance! :)

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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oliver Rising Star

oliver

Posted
Posted

Good Luck! Occasionally, the seedbank associated with Fairchild and Montgomery in Florida auctions off some Microcycas seeds. They usually go for at least $10 per seed, and as far as I have heard, are less than 5% viable. I heard that a sprouted seed recently was sold in California for about $500. Don't know about E. latifrons if there are any viable seeds being produced outside (or even inside) South Africa.

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Thank you very much for your wish and for the info Oliver! :)

At what season are these auctions commonly held and how can one be part of them?

I found a E. latifrons seedling but is ridiculously pricey and i certainly want more that one plant of that species... :( I hope that i will be able to get some seeds at some point soon...

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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jkjt11 Rookie

jkjt11

Posted
Posted

If you go to botanicalauctions.com you can register for upcoming auctions. A few months back they had an auction for microcycas calocoma seeds.

I bid on them but the price was rather high and the germination rates were low. Never heard of anybody selling latifrons seeds. Probably would need

to find a small seedling or offset- but even a 2-3 leaf plant likely would cost close to $1000 US. Best of luck. Jeff

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Thank you very much for the info and for the wish Jeff! :)

I 'll do! :) I want Microcycas seeds maybe more than any other cycad's seeds so i would be very happy if i do find any at an auction and will try to buy enough to guarantee me 5 plants :)

So E. latifrons seems an even toughter cycd to find seeds off...I will probably follow your advise and buy seedlings if i can find any at considerably less than a 1000$ each...

Now lets just hope the auction doesnt take long to appear...

I really need the luck you wished me,thank you! :)

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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tropicalb Mentor

tropicalb

Posted
Posted

Kostas

before you possibly waste a lot of money, i think you should know that microcycas are one of the hardest cycads to grow from seed. I know a lot of very good growers here in southern california that have a very hard time with this plant, which is one of the reasons they are so expensive. The seed is viable for only a very short time, and you would probably do better to buy at least a three year old seedling from a known grower for best results. Getting them past the two leaf stage is the hardest part about growing these particular cycads.

good luck!

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BS Man about Palms Grand Master

BS Man about Palms

Posted
Posted
Kostas

before you possibly waste a lot of money, i think you should know that microcycas are one of the hardest cycads to grow from seed. I know a lot of very good growers here in southern california that have a very hard time with this plant, which is one of the reasons they are so expensive. The seed is viable for only a very short time, and you would probably do better to buy at least a three year old seedling from a known grower for best results. Getting them past the two leaf stage is the hardest part about growing these particular cycads.

good luck!

I got a 3 leafer! I'm home free! :lol:

Zone 10a at best after 2007 AND 2013, on SW facing hill, 1 1/2 miles from coast in Oceanside, CA. 30-98 degrees, and 45-80deg. about 95% of the time.

"The great workman of nature is time."   ,  "Genius is nothing but a great aptitude for patience."

-George-Louis Leclerc de Buffon-

I do some experiments and learning in my garden with palms so you don't have to experience the pain! Look at my old threads to find various observations and tips!

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LJG Grand Master

LJG

Posted
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Well if you find some for under $1000 then it is probably not E. latifrons.

I am not wasting my money on microcycas right now. A lot of cycad people got seed in FL and soon will have some plants of good size. I have heard they are rather fast growing. I have seen some good sized ones for sale in FL that were under 10 years old.

So E. latifrons seems an even toughter cycd to find seeds off...I will probably follow your advise and buy seedlings if i can find any at considerably less than a 1000$ each...

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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tropicalb Mentor

tropicalb

Posted
Posted
Well if you find some for under $1000 then it is probably not E. latifrons.

I am not wasting my money on microcycas right now. A lot of cycad people got seed in FL and soon will have some plants of good size. I have heard they are rather fast growing. I have seen some good sized ones for sale in FL that were under 10 years old.

So E. latifrons seems an even toughter cycd to find seeds off...I will probably follow your advise and buy seedlings if i can find any at considerably less than a 1000$ each...

have you checked the price of a microcycas lately len? hold on to yer hat!

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LJG Grand Master

LJG

Posted
Posted

I have. I think it is over priced. I think it will be a lot cheaper a few years down the road.

Well if you find some for under $1000 then it is probably not E. latifrons.

I am not wasting my money on microcycas right now. A lot of cycad people got seed in FL and soon will have some plants of good size. I have heard they are rather fast growing. I have seen some good sized ones for sale in FL that were under 10 years old.

So E. latifrons seems an even toughter cycd to find seeds off...I will probably follow your advise and buy seedlings if i can find any at considerably less than a 1000$ each...

have you checked the price of a microcycas lately len? hold on to yer hat!

Len

Vista, CA (Zone 10a)

Shadowridge Area

"Show me your garden and I shall tell you what you are."

-- Alfred Austin

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Thank you very much all of you for the info! :)

Burt,

Thank yu very much for caring! :) I know of this difficulty and that not many seeds are viable but i imagine that buying ,say,100seeds would be much much more afordable than buying 5 three leafers,right?What is about the price for a 3leafer?Also,what is the main problem that makes passing the 2leaf stage difficult?Rot or something else?

Lens,

Thanks for that info :) Do they currently offer seedlings for sale in Florida and about for how much?Do you know of anyone maybe willing to ship internationally?

Good to know you're fear free Bill! :lol:

Thank you very much in advance! :)

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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Cycadcenter Experienced

Cycadcenter

Posted
Posted

Kostas,

Once again, how are you going to ship the plants or seeds legally, Microcycas and Encephalartos are CITES APP 1 which means thay have to have CITES Export Permits from the USA and possibly CITES Import Permits from your country.

The CITES Export Permit from the USA is issued by Fish and Wildlife and are VERY difficult to obtain. For Appendix 1 plants or seeds. The plants or seeds have to be proven to be second generation artificially propagated which take many, many years. It is not just a simple case of walking in and getting a permit.

Bruce

Now living the life in Childers, Queensland.

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Thank you very much for your reply Bruce :)

I will try and get the needed CITES Export Permit,since,especially for Microcycas seeds,my source will most probably be a botanic garden,it should be able to supply me the proof needed to get the permit! :)

If my source is a grower,what proof is needed to get such a permit?I really dont see the reason getting such a permit for foreign species,whose export from their home countries has been forbiden for seeds,should be so difficult as finding wild collected seeds of such Encephalartos in USA is just impossible now,too many years since the restrictions have passed to have any chance to own habitat collected seeds...

Anyway,my main problem for now is finding the actual seeds...When i find them,i will have time to worry about getting the permit :)

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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Cycadcenter Experienced

Cycadcenter

Posted
Posted

Sorry Kostas, it's just not that easy, say what you like about the necessity of CITES Permits, it is an international sgreement and the Fish and Wildlife are just doing their job. Just because the seeds may come from a Botanical Garden doesn't mean they will meet the criteria for an APP I CITES Permit. To do that they would have to have a valid CITES Import Permit for the mother AND father plants or qualify for a pre CITES exemption. (you still have to prove they were legally imported) Also remember that CITES also covers plant parts which includes pollen.

To qualify for CITES APP I Export permits the seeds/plants have to be proven to be second gerneration AP.

Do I agree with the rules, Yes and no but the rules are the rules. I was a member for several years of the CSG of the IUCN and we tried to have the rules changed to allow for first generation Artificially Propagated APP I seed to be traded as App II seed but were unsuccessful.

If you were to buy Microcycas seed at the auction, the web site catagorically states that the seed is not for export.

BTW I germinated 5 out of 50 seeds from a prior auction and have three at the 3 leaf stage.

As for the latifrons seeds or seedlings, I've heard that around $1,000 is the going price for a one leaf seedling now. AND these would definitely NOT be exportable.

As I said before, I would set your goals a little lower and collect what you can or you may die empty handed many years down the road.

Bruce

Now living the life in Childers, Queensland.

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tropicalb Mentor

tropicalb

Posted
Posted

LOL...just noticed after Bruce's post that Kostas is from Greece.

Bruce is correct Kostas....I seriously doubt that you will be able to get CITES APPENDIX I seed from any USA source, and the auction that was mentioned in posts above will not ship seeds outside the US.

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jkjt11 Rookie

jkjt11

Posted
Posted

Hi, You may want to look at the cycadsforafrica.com website. They are from South Africa and appear to have the proper permits-the website has photos of cycads

they have for sale- I think there's one latifrons for sale. I have never personally purchased from them so you may want to research it further. I don't know about

obtaining a CITES export permit but this summer I was considering importing cycads and was able to get a CITES import permit in about 4 weeks with a little bit of

effort. It may well be a good idea to start with the more common cycads first - BUT don't give up- they're great plants to collect. Jeff

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Thank you very much for your replys all of you! :)

Thank you very much for all this info Bruce! :) Seems quite difficult to do unfortunately but i will still try and get it...There should be a way... :)

For what its worth it,thank you very much for trying to change these rules to something one can comply with easier since there is no real risk to the species by exporting it from a non native country to another non native one...Especially seeds... :)

Yes,i found out that the auction site says that it doesnt do export but it also says that if a person from a foreign country wants to participate,he must provide a US address to ship the seeds,so one can participate with the address of a friend of his and get the papers and do the export on his own :)

Not quite a good germination rate,i know but unfortunately thats something that one who wants to grow this species has to put up with :( Good to hear you have 3 Microcycas growing well for you! :)

Yes,thats the price i saw too unfortunately from California growers carring this cycad...However,they do are willing to ship woldwide with the nessesery papers :) I will certainly prefer the South African source though as its cheaper and has a good reputation! :) I will consider the California growers though for species of other genuses i want,such as Ceratozamia,Bowenia and Zamia in the near future! :)

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Good suggestion Bruce!But i am really set on these species,i tend to only grow what i really want and not purchase what i can find just to have something to grow! :) I will do grow Lepidozamia though,which i both like them a lot and its easy to find seed off...But i will still be on the search for the Encephalartos and Microcycas till i find them,Lepidozamias are one thing and Encephalartos and Microcycas another! :)

Thanks Burt for your reply! :)

What would be another Microcycas seed source then?I do can find E. latifrons seedlings for sale for a relatively good price but Microcycas,i cant find it anywhere and paying it as much as latifrons too wouldnt be very good since i want to have 5 in hope of getting male and female plants...I just hope i can find a way to get the neccessery permits if i can manage to get the seeds first of course... :(

I know the auction wont ship internationally but i could have them shipped at a friend of mine in US and then arrange for the permits and shipping myself! :)

Thank you very much for your suggestion and encouragement Jeff! :)

Bruce had told me about Cycads for Africa website and seems like a good solution for Encephalartos species as it seems that getting seeds of Encephalartos from anywhere, would be very difficult and you also have to know that the source is honest and the species correct...I checked on this website and learnt that they are good people to be trusted about species names and purity :)

Import permits tend to be easier to get from what i know but may also be wrong...I hope to have the same experience as you when it is to get an export permit...

Again,thanks for the encouragement! :)

Do you maybe know of a Microcycas seed source that would be easier for me to import seeds of?

Thank you very much in advance! :)

''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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Cycadcenter Experienced

Cycadcenter

Posted
Posted

Kostas,

I have dealt with US Fish and Wildlife for nearly 20 years and have never been able to get permits for APP I AP seeds or seedlings and I thought I submitted impecable records and providence for the plants and I've been denied every time.

This is a link to the Fish & wildlife site;

http://www.fws.gov/permits/applicationform...PQ.shtml#plants

You will need to be sure that the producers of the seeds or plants are registered for those species under the CAPP system

The two form you will need to file are 3-200-33 and 3-200-32

Also I hope you have the patience to wait 50-75 years for your latifrons to cone. (grown under ideal conditions)

Bruce

Now living the life in Childers, Queensland.

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  • 2 weeks later...
ghar41 Veteran

ghar41

Posted
Posted
Also I hope you have the patience to wait 50-75 years for your latifrons to cone. (grown under ideal conditions)

Bruce

Hi Bruce,

Geez, 1000's of dollars for seedlings....50-75 years to cone.....

Dick Johnson had a massive latifrons with over 6 feet of trunk. I wonder whatever happened to this priceless plant since his passing? Sorry to get off topic.

Glenn

Modesto, California

 

Sunset Zone 14   USDA 9b

 

Low Temp. 19F/-7C 12-20-1990         

 

High Temp. 111F/43C 07-23-2006

 

Annual Average Precipitation 13.12 inches/yr.

 

             

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  • 2 months later...
simonwpb Newbie

simonwpb

Posted
Posted
Hello! :)

I am looking for Microcycas calocoma and Encephalartos latifrons seeds :) I know these arent palms but many of you grow cycads too or even own nurseries raising them!So,has any of you got any sure,pure seeds of these species or maybe know a good and reliable source to buy them?Even a few would do and so if you had bought some in the past and maybe have a few spare left,i would love to buy from you if you got them of a reliable source :) Also,i could think about fullfilling minimum orders of these in case its needed...

Thank you very much in advance! :)

Here is a picture of my microcycas. Never been able to germinate any seeds though. :bummed:

post-3086-1238369015_thumb.jpg

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Kostas Grand Master

Kostas

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Microcycas are beauties,thanks for the photo Simon :)

No,i havent been able to find Microcycas seeds yet but i am working on it... :) I have found other species i wanted though and i am testing my germinating abilities with cycads...With palms and Cycas sp.,i have no problem but with other cycads,well,i am getting tested for Microcycas :)

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''To try,is to risk failure.......To not try,is to guarantee it''

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